Shouldn't Iokan (1+) Be Larubian? (( a Laruba villager ))

[idioticidioms]

uh.... you know you just proved me right, right? By stating that with Azala and her Black Tyrano still in the picture that the Iokans and Larubians are wiped out, you reinforce what I said about Crono and Co. being the deciding factor.

I admit to being wrong about the Iokans as they were strong enough to fight the reptites on their own, but Ayla was still the strongest of them all, but they would not have won the war between the reptites on their own, with Lavos out of the picture.

[xcalibur]

uh.... you know you just proved me right, right? By stating that with Azala and her Black Tyrano still in the picture that the Iokans and Larubians are wiped out, you reinforce what I said about Crono and Co. being the deciding factor.

I admit to being wrong about the Iokans as they were strong enough to fight the reptites on their own, but Ayla was still the strongest of them all, but they would not have won the war between the reptites on their own, with Lavos out of the picture.

well yes, all that is true. I just wanted to clarify that while crono & co were a deciding factor, ayla was strong enough to lead her tribe to victory (or at least survival) in the original lavos timeline without crono.

The last statement you made brings up the whole debate about lavos, and whether he was destroyed at 1999 or removed from all times via pocket dimension theory.. the reptite ending supports the latter, since the ice age (caused by lavos) helped wipe out the reptite race.

[idioticidioms]

Defeating Azala is the key in that, because you must defeat Lavos before defeating Azala to obtain the reptite ending. Lavos might have weakened the reptites, allowing Ayla and her tribe to defeat them, but Without Lavos' help, they would have lost the fight, which is shown by the ending.

[xcalibur]

Defeating Azala is the key in that, because you must defeat Lavos before defeating Azala to obtain the reptite ending. Lavos might have weakened the reptites, allowing Ayla and her tribe to defeat them, but Without Lavos' help, they would have lost the fight, which is shown by the ending.

true indeed. It makes sense, considering that the reptites were more advanced physically, intellectually, technologically, and by any other measure. I could discuss them further, but that'd really sidetrack things.

[Acacia Sgt]

Actually, defeating Lavos before it destroys 1999 AD will not change the fact it will crash on the Tyrano Lair back in 65M BC.

In fact, if anything, the deciding factor was probably Crono and company's influence in their first visit to the era. If you think about it, they aren't really changing much when Lavos finally arrives to the planet if they just returned to their times after defeating it.

[Lord J Esq]

In fact, if anything, the deciding factor was probably Crono and company's influence in their first visit to the era.

That couldn't be the case, since there was a timeline prior to the adventures of Crono & Co. where human civilization ended up turning out the same way.

Interesting to see this discussion; who knew there was such passion behind the faction that thinks Iokans are weak? I don't see it, myself. They lived in a survival of the fittest era, and stealth was not their forte. They had to have been strong even to have gotten as far as they did. Ayla must have been at the top of a very competitive pyramid, rather than a big fish in a small pond.

Metaphors...mixed!

[xcalibur]

Actually, defeating Lavos before it destroys 1999 AD will not change the fact it will crash on the Tyrano Lair back in 65M BC.

that is true.. it brings up an argument about the pocket dimension idea. I mean, presumably the fall of lavos caused the ice age which helped bring an end to the reptites, which is what I was thinking of. But what if he was only destroyed at 1999? I suppose there couldve been an ice age in the reptite timeline during which they survived underground.

what lord j said is correct - the reptites were destroyed in the original/lavos timeline before chronos adventure. the whole pocket dimension argument gets pretty messy though. its safe to say however, that WITH aylas leadership, the humans prevailed. but without ayla, and without the defeat of azala, the reptites won. But that brings us to the issue of why the reptite timeline doesnt take hold until you defeat lavos. and lavos wouldve had to be around for the events of 12000 bc as well as magus summoning in 600ad.. ahh, it gets too difficult.

didnt mean to open a can of worms!

[Acacia Sgt]

In fact, if anything, the deciding factor was probably Crono and company's influence in their first visit to the era.

That couldn't be the case, since there was a timeline prior to the adventures of Crono & Co. where human civilization ended up turning out the same way.

Think of it this way. Originally, it just goes:

*Humans and Reptites fight
*Lavos falls destroying Tyrano Lair
*Ice Age comes
*Reptites don't survive

But defeating Lavos doesn't change the above. So how does their fates invert then? By that point, the only difference was now that Crono and company visited the era. That's why it led me to think that probably, that had something to do with the change.