Dragon God Scene Retranslation(partial)

[utunnels]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKUoH9nMe6Q

ガッシュ
「ヤツは……　龍神は、この時空に姿をあらわすための仮の姿。

Belthasar:
That thing...is Dragon God's temporary form in order to appear in this space-time ( or can we translate it into dimension?)

ガッシュ
「龍神の本体は、別の時空にある。

Belthasar:
The Dragon God's actual body(main body, real body), exists in another space-time.

ガッシュ
「その凍てついた炎の正体は、異星生命体ラヴォスの一部じゃ。

Belthasar:
The Frozen Flame is in fact the alien creature Lavos' body part.

ガッシュ
「輝く炎。凍てついた炎とリンクして……

Blethasar:
The shining flame. Linked to the Frozen Flame... (? I don't quite get it)

ガッシュ
「新生命体“時喰い”の姿をかいまみる。
遠い未来で世界の時をとめてしまう。

Belthasar:
The new life form,  "Time Devourer", observes (this world). (Perhaps last sentence continues from here)
In the far future, the world's time will stopped.

キッド
「時喰い、だって！？
なんだ、それは……！？

Kid:
Time devour!?
What's that...!?

時の分かたれた場所にて、いま一度時をつむぎなさい、クロノ・トリガーよ……

Please go to the place where time was divided and thread it again, Chrono Trigger...

ガッシュ
「時喰い……
時の闇の彼方に巣くう、ラヴォスが進化した、新たな生命体。

Belthasar:
Time Devourer...
Using the Darkness beyond Time as its nest, Lavos has evolved into a new life form.

ガッシュ
「一度目覚めてしまったからには、時喰いは時空を喰らい始める。

Belthasar:
When it once awakes, it will begin to devour space and time.

ガッシュ
「すべては無に帰る。もういちど、はじめからやりなおすために……

Belthasar:
All will return to nothing, and start over from the beginning....

ガッシュ
「これを持って行きなさい。

Belthasar:
Take this.

Serge receives Time Egg.

ガッシュ
「その、時のたまごで時間をこえるのじゃ……

Belthar:
Use Time Egg to travel beyond time...

ガッシュ
「この世界を頼んだぞ……

Belthasar:
The world depends on you...


----------------------
Here's the English script, I feels it is more detailed:


Belthasar:
   That thing...
   the '"Dragon God"'...
   is only a quasi-existence...
   ...A temporary form that
   the real Dragon God uses
   in order to appear within
   this dimension.

Belthasar:
   The actual Dragon God
   was consumed long ago,
   in the distant past...
   Integrated by the entity
   known as Lavos in a time
   on the other side of the
   dimensional darkness.

Belthasar:
   The Frozen Flame is a
   splinter from the extra-
   terrestrial being Lavos.
  
Belthasar:
   The one who connects with
   the Frozen Flame, in effect,
   links with Lavos itself.

Belthasar:
   As the mediator between Lavos
   and living things, that one will
   gain extraordinary powers!
   By binding with the new
   seed of destruction...
   the '"Devourer of Time!"'

Kid:
   What in blazes is
   a Devourer of Time!?

Member:
   What in the world's
   A Devourer of Time!?
 
 [Belthasar?]
   Now, go to the place where time
   became divided and weave the
   threads of time together again...
   Chrono Trigger!
  
Belthasar:
   The Devourer of Time
   is a new life-form...
   Born out of the fusion of a
   life-form from this planet with
   Lavos, who nests on the far
   side of the dimensional void.
  
Belthasar:
   In the far-off future, when
   the fusion becomes complete,
   IT will awaken...
  
Belthasar:
   Then, the Devourer of Time
   will begin to consume all
   space-time continua...
   Despair and hatred...
   To return all things to
   nothingness...
   That is what IT desires.
 
Belthasar:
   Here...
   Take this with you.
 
   [Member] received
   the Time Egg!

Belthasar:
   That Time Egg will
   enable you to travel
   beyond space-time...

Belthasar:
   The world is
   in your hands...
   Go!
   Release the life
   that is imprisoned...

[Chrono'99]

Wow, there are quite a few differences. The Japanese version doesn't say that the Dragon God was integrated by Lavos, just that it's in another space-time... Could he still be in his original Reptite dimension?

We know that Masato Kato supervised the English translation to clear up some fuzzy details, but these differences are curious. This one is really stunning too:

ガッシュ
「すべては無に帰る。もういちど、はじめからやりなおすために……

Belthasar:
All will return to nothing, and start over from the beginning....

In the Japanese version, the Time Devourer didn't simply want to destroy the universe; he wanted to destroy it to actually recreate a new universe?

[utunnels]

Yeah, it sounds like an interesting theory.

All life begins with Nu and ends with Nu...
All begins with null and ends with null...

[Eske]

Belthasar:
The Frozen Flame is in fact the alien creature Lavos' body part.

I think that settles some debate over the nature of the Frozen Flame.  I recall seeing posts about the FF being a separate object   etc,  but this takes care of that.

Also,

Belthasar:
   As the mediator between Lavos
   and living things, that one will
   gain extraordinary powers!
   By binding with the new
   seed of destruction...
   the '"Devourer of Time!"'

That entire concept looks like it was just made up for the English translation, wtf

[utunnels]

Yeah, that's why I don't understand.

It seems Belthasar means those who touched the Flame will gain powers, and be bound with Time Devourer?

And the JPN script even doesn't say "Dragon God was consumed by Lavos". It seems the English script is about to explain that, but it still doesn't say how Dragon God was consumed.

[Chrono'99]

Wait, isn't the Dragon God also called "Time Devourer" during the battle in the Japanese version, like in the English one?

That entire concept looks like it was just made up for the English translation, wtf

It's a concept from the Ultimania Guide, which states that Arbiters of Time are meant to merge with Lavos.

[utunnels]

Wait, isn't the Dragon God also called "Time Devourer" during the battle in the Japanese version, like in the English one?

Yes, it is.


----------


Belthasar:
   The Dragon Gods were originally
   a singular plasma life-form...
   ...A living accumulation of the
   planet's energy!
   Originally it was a biological
   machine used to control the
   powers of nature in the future
   society of the Reptites.
   In order to control the natural
   energy itself, FATE divided the
   one Dragon God entity up into
   6 weaker plasma life-forms...
   Then scattered them across
   the land and sealed them away.
   Their dragon-like appearances
   are just pseudo-guises...
   ...Temporary forms they take
   so that they can appear in
   this dimension.

Belthasar always says temporary form...but does dimension traval has some limits so the traveller must take another form, or...

[Thought]

Belthasar:
The Frozen Flame is in fact the alien creature Lavos' body part.

...

Blethasar:
The shining flame. Linked to the Frozen Flame... (? I don't quite get it)

First, thank you VERY much for the retranslation. I've always wondered how the original script compared to the NA translation, and it seems it varies substantially in some parts.

In these quotes, perhaps "the shining flame" is either Lavos or the one claiming the Frozen Flame?

Or, to take a wackier approach, perhaps the FF is actually the "Shining Flame" and Lavos is the Frozen Flame (that is, the big fire that fell to earth and was sent ot the DBT, where time stops; without the progression of time, it would appear that a fire has frozen, hence...)

As for the Dragon God thingy, Belthasar might not even mean dimension as in "Home World" and "Another World." He might mean something more along the lines of a hyperdimensional shape appearing in a lower dimension (a sphere manifesting in 2-dimensions would appear to be a circle, for example). That would sort of fit along the lines of a "suedo-guise."

[utunnels]

Yeah, actually, it means TD is linked to the Frozen Flame, so it can make contact with this world.
Belthasar doesn't metion who touches the Flame will gain power or what what.
But obviously, the one who touches it will make contact with TD(or can we say Lavos) itself.

I still don't get it. Lavos pulled Chronopolis from the future, but something(the planet?) pulled Dinopolis from another dimension?
It makes me wonder, is there something the planet can't do?

[Thought]

Yeah, actually, it means TD is linked to the Frozen Flame, so it can make contact with this world.
Belthasar doesn't metion who touches the Flame will gain power or what what.
But obviously, the one who touches it will make contact with TD(or can we say Lavos) itself.

I still don't get it. Lavos pulled Chronopolis from the future, but something(the planet?) pulled Dinopolis from another dimension?
It makes me wonder, is there something the planet can't do?

See, that curiosity with the FF is that it seems to largely act against the best interest of the TD. It seems to grant Serge the ability to challenge and defeat the TD. Why? This might be Schala's doing... or it might be that Lavos is also opposed to the TD. If Lavos is working for the survival of its species, then the TD will destory them as much as anyone else. But that is a rather far strech.

As for what the planet can't do, it appears it can't work directly, only through proxy (Crono & Co, Dinopolis, etc).

[utunnels]

Or perhaps that is a side effect of Time Crash, or even a basic rule of the nature: if a massive change which can affect the main flow of the history happens, a counter balance equivalent must be pulled in.
Ah, just a random thought though.



Some names are really confusing...


次元のゆがみ(dimensional distortion) in CT DS is translated as dimensional vortex.

次元の狭間(dimension breach) in CC is translated as temporal vortex.

In CC, as Lucca metioned, a dimensional vortex(次元の渦) swallowed Schala.

But in RD, it is 時の渦(temporal vortex or time vortex).

It seems usage of time and dimension is really messed up.

[radicalblues]

It seems usage of time and dimension is really messed up.

And thus the compendiumites finally cape up to a conclusion for the Chrono series.

[Magus_Brokenhart]

Wow, I think you might be right about Lavos being opposed to the Time Devourer. Lavos is very intent on procreation and perfection. It waits millions upon millions of years to achieve perfection. I don't think it would desire to destroy all that hard work, or eliminate the universe, and thus, his very species. I do think that merging with Schala actually tainted Lavos. The creature seemed to be ultra smart, and perhaps emotionless by our standards. Fusing with an emotional human, especially one that is as emo as Schala, would mess Lavos up deeply. Perhaps it too was like Schala, and a side of it wished to save Space-Time?