Chrono Spiritual Successor Brainstorm Session (Come and join the fun!)

[Boo the Gentleman Caller]

Hey Tush,

I'm not saying that passion is a bad thing... Just saying that it alone is not capable of seeing a project this big off the ground. If that were true, then AE:HU, CC:DBT, CT:AE and all the other Chrono fan games would have made it off the ground. I know that there were technical limitations to some extent, but let's not forget the real world applications at work here.



Also, if you feel very strongly about reworking CE, I'd honestly recommend you contacting Giro / Ruby Dragoon over at the Flames of Eternity. I'm completely serious. I mean, Flames of Eternity is a more completed version of Crimson Echoes, but you never know what they'd be willing to do. Just a thought. You could always work with us AND work them, that way you get your creative desires completely fulfilled.

Moving on, I think there are some good questions in those you proposed, Tush, but some of them don't apply in this scenario. This is essentially a "start up" venture, and it's completely different from an established project with an established organization. Some of these questions are null and void (crossed out), while others are future-oriented and italicized; it is simply too early to try to answer those questions.

Development:
1) What are we targeting?
2) Depending on platform targets, what engines and toolkits will we be using?
3) What niches haven't been filled already? Or do we intend to piggy-back on existing genres and models?
4) What are competitions not doing right?
5) What Supplies are consumers looking for that don't exist yet? What would get them to pay?
6) How do we prevent piracy effectively? Should we go with the Angry Birds model?
7) How do we intend to monetize? What's our business model, and how are we distributing?
8.) Who will begin the Design Document? Where? How?

Story and Gameplay:
9) What is the story about? Describe in only three sentences.
10) What is the synopsis of the story? Within one paragraph.
11) Who is the protagonist? Within one paragraph.
12) What is the game, environment and setting like? What will it look like? What will it feel like? 2D or 3D, or something in the middle (like CC)?
13) How will we produce the game? What are our goals?
14) What's so special about the game? What and how will it sell?
15) What Language of implementation can we afford currently, based on our targets?

Practicality:
16) How much Time can we afford to invest in this? What are our (realistic) deadlines?
17) What is our budget of production? What kind of rewards will the developers (writers, artists, programmers, etc.) will obtain from this?
18.) What quality is our end-goal?

[FaustWolf]

I've always felt CE's strength lies in how it digs deeper into something that's already present. It's like any good sequel in that regard; to analogize, James Cameron couldn't have produced classics like Aliens or Terminator 2 without having a foundation to explore. If you want to create something that carries the same impact Crimson Echoes did, you must first have the spiritual tribute to Chrono Trigger in place. My two cents anyway.


I'd be curious to get feedback from experienced programmers on the pluses and minuses of Unity, which tushantin mentioned earlier. It's advertised as a multiplatform solution, with Linux support being rolled out from what I'm able to understand. Unity should reduce the development pipeline by providing basic game engine functions out-of-the-box, with C# and a JavaScript-like language being the two most popular scripting approaches. I've seen indie developers use it for both pure 2D and pure 3D, and I'm told on the support forums that a hybrid aesthetic should be doable as well. There are license costs of course (and per-platform licenses), so that's one thing. If the project looks serious and my hopes for a low-cost lifestyle pan out, my interest in Unity is such that I'd be interested in donating the licenses. But I imagine finding a way to share them across a geographically distributed programming team could get tricky. After learning about Unity I have a giant interest in C#, but I have to admit it'd be many moons before I'm up to snuff enough to pitch in with an effort like this.


Dream Splash! 2013 is coming up if I'm not mistaken? It might be interesting if the theme were to set to hash out some of the basics of the project proposed here. People could propose time travel theories, gameplay ideas, concept art for different eras of the new world's history...might be enough to get a rich primordial soup going. But I'm not sure how much this would end up conflicting with the idea of a closed team carrying the project to a professional conclusion. At what point should the project transition from the open-source discussion we're enjoying here to a more traditional, closed model of game development?

[idiotekque]

Just gotta say DRM is stupid invention. It only serves to annoy legitimate buyers, since pirates can crack anything. DRM-free is the way to go.

If the game did take off, we should immediately look into getting it on Desura. If anyone hasn't heard of that, just Google it and check it out. It's comparable to Steam, but is easier to get on and is a massive marketplace for indie developers. It would be great to get on Steam, too, but Desura is a great staging point, even for alpha versions of games.

[Thought]

Faust, good point. A Crimson Echoes needs a Chrono Trigger. To take a step away from Crimson Echoes would also take a step away from Chrono Trigger, and thus weaken the entire thing. Better to go forward with a game inspired by CT, to better catch that magic.

As for when the game should make a switch from open source to intense development, I'd say as soon as a team leader comes forward and decides it's time. Everything really depends on that lead, which, unfortunately, might mean that nothing will really happen until years, maybe decades, down the line and a fan gets established in a career, remembers CT, and decides to put the company they've built onto it.

[tushantin]

Also, if you feel very strongly about reworking CE, I'd honestly recommend you contacting Giro / Ruby Dragoon over at the Flames of Eternity. I'm completely serious. I mean, Flames of Eternity is a more completed version of Crimson Echoes, but you never know what they'd be willing to do. Just a thought. You could always work with us AND work them, that way you get your creative desires completely fulfilled.

The problem with the FoE team, as you mentioned earlier, is that they may not be willing to give credit to the original developers -- ZeaLitY, Agent 12 and Crono'99. If what you're saying is right, then I have no intention of working with shallow people as that. (Because the whole point is to save the CE team's efforts of their art by actually saving their art, and let them have credit for it... The only thing I actually want out of this is, 1) Monetary rewards for my efforts, and 2) Credit and success for the art I add into it so I can sustain my career.)

That said, thanks for refining the questions list! But why cross out targets? What's the point of putting effort into something and wanting to be sure about it when you're not having set goals?

And why cross out "what's so special about this game"? Isn't that question important when it comes to innovation?

[Kodokami]

Dream Splash! 2013 is coming up if I'm not mistaken? It might be interesting if the theme were to set to hash out some of the basics of the project proposed here. People could propose time travel theories, gameplay ideas, concept art for different eras of the new world's history...might be enough to get a rich primordial soup going.

I think having this game concept be the topic for our next Dream Splash is a good idea. We ought to see what everyone (and by everyone I mean those interested in this game concept) is capable of adding to the project, and get a decent stone soup boiling, before jumping the bandwagon.

Also, if I may be so bold to ask, how many of us can actually say they have experience in game development? Sold a game on the market? We may be in over our heads here to propose a full length game. I'd still like to try, but only if we're serious about it. I do suggest that those who are interested read up on game development (I found these two articles to be highly informative).

[Boo the Gentleman Caller]

No experience in game development, minus writing. I helped write (and am still writing) Chrono Shift, although now it's just the script process.

However, I do have experience in project management and development, however, which helps me have a good grasp for conceptually designing and seeing projects to completion. That included retail banking products and software platforms and had nothing to do with video games.

[Acacia Sgt]

I've once participated in the creation of a game. I didn't got to do much other than write dialogue, design a character, and come up with some plot concepts, though almost all of it got overhauled, and I eventually got left behind so to speak. Partly my fault, though.

Anyway, I do have knowledge and experience in working with Math. So while I may not, say, know how to code battle mechanic formulas, I could come up with them. And other related stuff like parameters, AI behavior, and stuff.

[Thought]

I do suggest that those who are interested read up on game development (I found these two articles to be highly informative).

Those articles largely present the same information you'll find about succeeding, professionally, at any creative endeavor. The difference between a fan game and a real game is that one gets completed, the other doesn't. And the force behind that difference is the willingness to slog through a project past the point of sanity, until it's done.

I don't have any experience in game development. The closest I come is in trying to develop the story lines for a few. Since the last project I worked on, I have written a few books, so I should be better at that (and more likely to complete it, too). Still, books are different than game stories and scripts.

[idiotekque]

I'm a writer and have done a lot of lore work, so I'd be completely willing to do the background/busy work that fleshes out the game's universe, especially if there was a codex function integrated (think of Dragon Age, which did an excellent job at creating a deep, meticulous back-story behind things).

I've also done some screenwriting and have schooled in it a bit, so at the very least I could help where there's a need in that category.

[Schala Zeal]

FaustWolf: If I've read correctly, I believe Xamarin's iPhone and Android kits are $300 each. I don't know if Unity has its own.

[tushantin]

Looks like I'm the only one on board as an artist, not just for concept and character art but also proficient in 3D (I actually even taught some of you here how to use Blender). And recently I've also acquired some new graphic design skillz!

That said, I also know a bit of screenwriting (see Moonlight Reckoning and Polar Detective). I've also helped a few (community) projects with plot and character ideas, as some of you already know of. And I must say, if the project is to move forward, all this makes me an indispensable addition to the team.

I haven't any experience in (professional) game development, but that will change soon as 1) I've recently sent in my pitch to a company, hoping they'd be interested, and 2) I can leverage this project (if you guys follow through) as my professional experience and thus propel me in my career.

......God, I sound like I'm giving an interview. Can we have some informal humor in here?

[idiotekque]

I've schooled in and have done graphic design work too. Been playing with Photoshop since I was waist-high.

[Thought]

Photoshop? Photoshop! BAH! Young kids today, they have everything handed to them on a silver platter. Now Dr. Doodle, THAT was a graphic creation program!

Next, you'll be telling me you never used a blue screen Wordperfect program, either!

[Acacia Sgt]

Waist-high? The waist of who?

I've drawn.... in paint... does that counts? Nah, I already stated in what I can work best.