Did crono die when porre attacked

[kazmaka]

like i said that was someone elses idea not mine, so i wouldnt have the evidence. but still your avoiding the question, if your having a go at me as to why they wouldnt forget their magic, give me evidence that says yes they keep their magic spekkio didnt teach them anything he unlocked innate power that resides in either those chosen people or every living human due to the effect of lavos changing their dna or just cos us humans kick ass. if you cant them just shut up.

[Sentenal]

Its really hard to read your post.  Grammar helps.

The quote I provided proves that Magic is in everyone, it just needs to be unlocked.  Did Spekkio teach Magus magic?  Other than his element, his is the same as Cronos.  Magus' magic never went away, not even in Radical Dreamers.

You really have no evidence, or anything backing you, and so you end your arguement with "shut up".  I'm not wasting my time on an immature person who think he can say any theory, and be immune from disagreement, dispite everyone countering him.

[V_Translanka]

So, according to you Ozzie, Slash and Flea in CC are imposters because they don't use magic as the Mystic Warriors did in CT?

Since Ozzie, Flea & Slash are simply New Game+ material in CC, they really aren't anything but an easter egg. What they are and what they use thus do not matter and have no relevence.

Also, kazmaka, I know damn well you can use the quote tags...why'd you stop (mid-post in some cases)? It's a lot easier to read posts w/quotes in them...when quote tags are used...

2: Wrong wrong wrong. Speikko mearly unlocked their Magic abilities, he didn't give them anything. Zeal's magic was Lavos magic, and different from Crono's (as per the people in Zeal saying it). And Elements are things that the Dragonians manufactured. That are not magic.

Firstly, I don't think Zeal's Magic is that different from Crono's. Perhaps they all use Shadow Magic...Or simply their Magic is at higher levels, but I don't see how either of them could be using different Magic, since both Magus and the others share Magic Techs and Zeal & Spekkio also share a Magic Tech.

Also, the CC Elements are just as magical, but slightly different. They aren't manufactured, but more refined or something, seeing how they come from the planet. I think the energies could even be compared in that Lavos drained the Planet's energy and thus Zeal used Lavos to use their own Magic (or to simply increase the power) and the Planet's energy was used to create the CC Elements.

And, about the ghosts...I doubt it was either of them saying that line (but I'm still not entirely sure if it was FATE or who said it at all)...Miguel says that they are just the ghosts of that dying timeline and that you shouldn't even pay attention to them.

we know spekkio didnt teach it seeing as he wasnt even around back then, at least you never see or hear of him, what poeple have assumed is that gaspar taught them, and spekkio is nu/dream spirit kinda thing of gaspar. and what the hell you just avoided the question.

Who assumes that Gaspar taught Zeal how to use magic?? That makes no sense at all, for if anything it would be the Queen who taught Zeal magical useage.

Check out my thread called "Who Taught Magic In Zeal" in the Magic forum...Let's not get side-tracked by something already in another thread, hmm?

[SilentMartyr]

we know spekkio didnt teach it seeing as he wasnt even around back then, at least you never see or hear of him, what poeple have assumed is that gaspar taught them, and spekkio is nu/dream spirit kinda thing of gaspar. and what the hell you just avoided the question.

Who assumes that Gaspar taught Zeal how to use magic?? That makes no sense at all, for if anything it would be the Queen who taught Zeal magical useage.

Check out my thread called "Who Taught Magic In Zeal" in the Magic forum...Let's not get side-tracked by something already in another thread, hmm?

Well if I had a thread to advertise, I would have posted it too :-p

[CatchRBFivy]

I read this whole thread (which took forever and is killing my eyes) and I have one huge question that popped up with all this magic talk.

If Crono and everyone has magic separate from the Zealians (Lavos magic) then they can keep it after they defeat Lavos since its "Planet Magic".  However, if magic is truly infinite and never goes away, then how come Ayla cannot learn magic at all.  I don't know the exact quote but it won't matter since 100% of you will know where it is in CT.  But Spekkio tells the group that Ayla was born before magic existed.  Wouldn't this imply that ALL MAGIC came directly from Lavos and not the planet?  Because there was no magic in the timeline until 12,000 bc.  So Crono and co. would lose the ability to use magic once Lavos was defeated, right?

I'm just throwing this out there, don't be as harsh to me as you were with kazmaka, who by the way is ridiculous.

[Sentenal]

In CC, the Dragonians say that Humans only started to evolve from apes when the found the Frozen Flame, some year between Ayla's time and Zeal, I forget the year.  But this brings up a question:  What is the difference between Ayla and people afterwards?  Magic.  The Frozen Flame must have influenced Human Evolution, allowing them to evolve magical ablities.

[kazmaka]

The quote I provided proves that Magic is in everyone, it just needs to be unlocked.  Did Spekkio teach Magus magic?  Other than his element, his is the same as Cronos.  Magus' magic never went away, not even in Radical Dreamers.

i may not have a quote but the earthbound people did not have magic therefore, no everybody did not have mgaic waiting to be unlocked. as youve said humans only got magic through lavos, through lavos altering their dna, we could assume the earthbound humans lacked this dna.

You really have no evidence, or anything backing you, and so you end your arguement with "shut up".  I'm not wasting my time on an immature person who think he can say any theory, and be immune from disagreement, dispite everyone countering him.

you still havent made a point that completely says my argument is definetly wrong, until you do, your argument is just as pointless as mine. i can accept that my theory may not be correct, but can you prove it?

Firstly, I don't think Zeal's Magic is that different from Crono's. Perhaps they all use Shadow Magic...Or simply their Magic is at higher levels, but I don't see how either of them could be using different Magic, since both Magus and the others share Magic Techs and Zeal & Spekkio also share a Magic Tech.

i would agree with this, in CT i wouldnt there are diferent types of magic, diferent elements yes, which could posibly be what the zealians are talking about, or diferent levels it, the zealians may have had it much more refined, or diferent parts of it, for example marle is water and yet gets ice, ice 2, cure, cure 2, life 2
frog is also water, but he gets water, water 2, cure 2, heal

so the zealians could have very diferent magic abilities all stemming from the same roots as crono's.

Also, kazmaka, I know damn well you can use the quote tags...why'd you stop (mid-post in some cases)? It's a lot easier to read posts w/quotes in them...when quote tags are used...

actaully i only just really realised the ease of doing that.

[Sentenal]

i may not have a quote but the earthbound people did not have magic therefore, no everybody did not have mgaic waiting to be unlocked. as youve said humans only got magic through lavos, through lavos altering their dna, we could assume the earthbound humans lacked this dna.

Whats your point?  They probably had not evolved the ablity to use magic.  They had been thrown out of Magic-using society, so unless in extreme circumstances, they would be unable acquire the magic using trait via reproduction.  I don't see how this is evidence agianst magic being something that people have.

you still havent made a point that completely says my argument is definetly wrong, until you do, your argument is just as pointless as mine. i can accept that my theory may not be correct, but can you prove it?

I see no reason to disprove a negative.  You say Crono is Miguel (or have you forgotten this?).  You are the one making the theory.  You back it up with evidence.  Thats how it works.  My theory?  Miguel is Miguel, and Crono is Crono.  Disprove that with facts.

[kazmaka]

i did back it up with evidence.

[Sentenal]

i did back it up with evidence.

Evidence?  Your evidence was "Crono would be White Element in CC", "Leena sounds like Leene", and "Marle wants to smash Crono to bits."

[kazmaka]

okay then, im really not bothered about what you say, i say crono could be miguel, you say he cant, whatever, you havent changed my view, i havent changed yours, not bothered.

[DeweyisOverrated]

I really don't think Crono = Miguel.  I've heard both sides of the argument, and this is why I believe Crono =! Miguel.

First off, look at it from the game production point.  Let's say that in the story production, they put in that they are the same person.  Now obviously, you're going to have to put in a ton of clues, and USUALLY something that pretty much spells the whole thing out for you.

In my opinion, CC doesn't have any of this.  There is no dialogue from Miguel that even does so much as suggest that he was ever a fighter, came from the mainland, anything.  It seems to me that any theories we have about him are based on assumptions we're making on other assumptions.  For example, we're assuming Crono is alive, not dead.  We're assuming he went into hiding, and is not in prison.  From there, we're assuming he travelled to El Nido, assuming he took an alternate identity, etc etc.  There is no actual PHYSICAL evidence in the game that any of this hapenned, so we're basically drawing conclusions based on "false" conclusions.

Obviously, I have no problem with people thinking that theory, I jsut personally don't agree with it, for the above reasons.


Also, Kazmaka, isn't most of your "evidence" from just reading around on the boards?  Because you still haven't played Chrono Cross, and no matter how much reading you do, you'll never be able to really understand what's going on until you play the game and put it together.

[kazmaka]

First off, look at it from the game production point.  Let's say that in the story production, they put in that they are the same person.  Now obviously, you're going to have to put in a ton of clues, and USUALLY something that pretty much spells the whole thing out for you.

okay they usually do this, but they may have wanted you to use imagination? put in some very sly clues and expect you to figure out the rest. they never tell you who or what the entity is but most of you wont hesitate to say its the planet.

There is no actual PHYSICAL evidence in the game that any of this hapenned, so we're basically drawing conclusions based on "false" conclusions.

again going with the enity theory.

Obviously, I have no problem with people thinking that theory, I jsut personally don't agree with it, for the above reasons.
[/qoute]

thankyou, thats the kind of attitude i would expect people to have.

Also, Kazmaka, isn't most of your "evidence" from just reading around on the boards?  Because you still haven't played Chrono Cross, and no matter how much reading you do, you'll never be able to really understand what's going on until you play the game and put it together.

most of my evidence and generally the reason i agree with this theory was based on my playing chrono cross, so no.

[kazmaka]

First off, look at it from the game production point.  Let's say that in the story production, they put in that they are the same person.  Now obviously, you're going to have to put in a ton of clues, and USUALLY something that pretty much spells the whole thing out for you.

okay they usually do this, but they may have wanted you to use imagination? put in some very sly clues and expect you to figure out the rest. they never tell you who or what the entity is but most of you wont hesitate to say its the planet.

There is no actual PHYSICAL evidence in the game that any of this hapenned, so we're basically drawing conclusions based on "false" conclusions.

again going with the enity theory.

Obviously, I have no problem with people thinking that theory, I jsut personally don't agree with it, for the above reasons.

thankyou, thats the kind of attitude i would expect people to have.

Also, Kazmaka, isn't most of your "evidence" from just reading around on the boards?  Because you still haven't played Chrono Cross, and no matter how much reading you do, you'll never be able to really understand what's going on until you play the game and put it together.

most of my evidence and generally the reason i agree with this theory was based on my playing chrono cross, so no.

[Sentenal]

okay they usually do this, but they may have wanted you to use imagination? put in some very sly clues and expect you to figure out the rest. they never tell you who or what the entity is but most of you wont hesitate to say its the planet.

The entity being the planet does have actual physical evidence, via the Japanese version.  But its identity really doesn't matter.

And Crono actually being in this game would have been a REALLY big part of the story, and yet they never even implied it.  Its fine if you want to use you imagination, but for big story elements, they spell it out for you.[/quote]