Poll

Global warming is...

Real! =(
16 (76.2%)
Real, but totally not a problem. (Sorry Tuvalu.)
3 (14.3%)
A practical means of boosting our global fish stocks.
2 (9.5%)

Total Members Voted: 20

Voting closed: March 14, 2006, 03:53:10 pm

Author Topic: Sinking In The Truth, The Truth Sinks In -- A Global Warming  (Read 7835 times)

Burning Zeppelin

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Sinking In The Truth, The Truth Sinks In -- A Global Warming
« Reply #45 on: March 18, 2006, 09:15:44 pm »
Quote from: Wikipedia
In cosmology, dark matter refers to hypothetical matter particles, of unknown composition, that do not emit or reflect enough electromagnetic radiation to be detected directly, but whose presence can be inferred from gravitational effects on visible matter such as stars and galaxies. The dark matter hypothesis aims to explain several anomalous astronomical observations, such as anomalies in the rotational speed of galaxies (the galaxy rotation problem). Estimates of the amount of matter present in galaxies, based on gravitational effects, consistently suggest that there is far more matter than is directly observable. The existence of dark matter would also resolve a number of inconsistencies in the Big Bang theory, and is crucial for structure formation.

If dark matter does exist, it has vastly more mass than the "visible" part of the universe. Only about 4% of the total mass in the universe (as inferred from gravitational effects) can be seen directly. About 22% is thought to be composed of dark matter. The remaining 74% is thought to consist of dark energy, an even stranger component, distributed diffusely in space, that probably cannot be thought of as ordinary particles. Determining the nature of this missing mass is one of the most important problems in modern cosmology and particle physics.

cupn00dles

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« Reply #46 on: March 19, 2006, 01:45:44 am »
The universe ends and begins all the time

"Past" is just information stored in the memory of the human brain

Only the fleeting moment of the present is existence, reality, the universe, orange juice

Whatever fraction of time is "present" is anihilated and reborn constantly

Under and over the laws of creation and destruction

:O

Hahahaha.

Lord J Esq

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« Reply #47 on: March 19, 2006, 04:18:41 am »
Quote from: ZeaLitY
The uncertainty of quantum mechanics takes care of that.

Not saying I agree or disagree, but I'd like some proof of that. (Since this thread is hopelessly off-topic anyway...)

GreenGannon

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« Reply #48 on: March 19, 2006, 04:34:17 am »
I'd agree and say that I think Global Warming is a potential problem, but since I'm a conservative and all, I don't think my opinion counts for a whle lot around here.

Maelstrom

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« Reply #49 on: March 19, 2006, 06:04:09 am »
Quote from: Daniel Krispin
Excuse my ignorance if this sounds stupid... but couldn't causality be seen as a form of fate? After all, if all things are cause and effect, that would imply that they've been set into causal motion since the Big Bang - as such, things now have been predetermined since the beginning. Wouldn't that be fate in and of itself? Maybe I just mis-interpreted that, though.


If you believe in fate, you can't deny that some of are destined to improve things and prepare for the future.  You can say we are fated to some end, but it'll be because of the actions of all people, conservatives (in the inaction sense, not the political one) and activists alike.

Even if it is all predetermined, it doesn't mean we can't cast blame, give credit, and take responsibility.

GrayLensman

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Carbon Tax
« Reply #50 on: March 19, 2006, 02:28:40 pm »
What do you think of a carbon tax?  I think this would be more effective way to reduce emissions than credits which can be bought and traded between companies.  If all fossil fuel emissions incurred at tax, it would provide an economic incentive for people to clean up their act.

The carbon tax revenue could be used to fund the development of clean energy infrastructure or income taxes could be lowed an equal amount.

Magus22

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« Reply #51 on: March 19, 2006, 02:55:16 pm »
we already pay for polution control

right?

ZeaLitY

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Sinking In The Truth, The Truth Sinks In -- A Global Warming
« Reply #52 on: March 19, 2006, 03:05:13 pm »
Quote from: Lord J esq
Quote from: ZeaLitY
The uncertainty of quantum mechanics takes care of that.

Not saying I agree or disagree, but I'd like some proof of that. (Since this thread is hopelessly off-topic anyway...)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Determinism#Determinism.2C_quantum_mechanics_and_classical_physics

That is all I can provide.

Radical_Dreamer

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Re: Carbon Tax
« Reply #53 on: March 19, 2006, 06:50:01 pm »
Quote from: GrayLensman
What do you think of a carbon tax?  I think this would be more effective way to reduce emissions than credits which can be bought and traded between companies.  If all fossil fuel emissions incurred at tax, it would provide an economic incentive for people to clean up their act.

The carbon tax revenue could be used to fund the development of clean energy infrastructure or income taxes could be lowed an equal amount.


Might be one way. I want to see more investment in hydrogen injection systems. Using tap water, they cause a 99% clean burn in internal combustion engines, gas or diesel. Not to mention a promised 10% fuel economy gain and nominal power gains. Too bad they're of the size and cost that they can only be used in trucks at the moment, but the technology has a lot of promise.

Daniel Krispin

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Re: Carbon Tax
« Reply #54 on: March 19, 2006, 07:16:42 pm »
Quote from: Radical_Dreamer
Quote from: GrayLensman
What do you think of a carbon tax?  I think this would be more effective way to reduce emissions than credits which can be bought and traded between companies.  If all fossil fuel emissions incurred at tax, it would provide an economic incentive for people to clean up their act.

The carbon tax revenue could be used to fund the development of clean energy infrastructure or income taxes could be lowed an equal amount.


Might be one way. I want to see more investment in hydrogen injection systems. Using tap water, they cause a 99% clean burn in internal combustion engines, gas or diesel. Not to mention a promised 10% fuel economy gain and nominal power gains. Too bad they're of the size and cost that they can only be used in trucks at the moment, but the technology has a lot of promise.


Really? Wow, that's impressive. It still requires fossil fuels, though - most every form of power nowadays has some great pollution drawback. I've heard that even burning hydrogen is as bad as fossil fuels because, even though the combustion product is simple water, the process of creating the hydrogen leaves about as much carbon dioxide as burning fossil fuels. Even larger scale than vehicals... any fossil fuel plant is plainly polluting. Nuclear would be perfect if not for the the problem of waste (though, I reckon that, if we're ever in space for prolonged periods, it'd be a useful power source there). Water power by dams messes up the local ecology. Wind power isn't so bad, but even that I've heard might have its drawbacks on wind currents. Solar doesn't have any ecological drawbacks, but takes a large area to provide any reasonable amount of power.

The thing is, though, it's not neccessary to provide such large power sources. You see, technically, it should be possible, via precise design and such things as solar power (or whatever is best for the locale) to design houses to be self-sustaining. Commercial buildings as well could be designed in that fashion. Energy to such things as manufacturing would still be a bit of a problem, but it would be easier to deal with that energy issue when all the commercial and residential ones are out of the picture (I'm guessing here; I really don't know what the percentage of power that goes to manufacturing is. It could be something like 90%, which would rather annul what I've said.) As for vehicals... the technology's progressing. It's not there yet, but it's making strides. Even here at my university there are researchers working on it. I had a Combustion Engines class last year, and the professor who taught us was working in that very field. He seemed rather optimistic about where things are going.

With all this, however, there's one problem, and that's the oil companies. Don't worry, I'm not getting all conspiracy theorist with this, but really... it's not in the best economic interest of the oil producing countries to find these alternatives, and as such destroy their major source of revenue. I know my region here would be greatly worsted by a lack of demand for petroleum. As such, even if it would be discovered... the ones who most need to make use of it wouldn't. It's the governments that are keeping these things back. Of course, I'm totally ignorant as far as politics go, but one things I'm not happy about with the Conservatives here (whom I usually prefer) is that they seem all too focussed on big business, and won't go along with Kyoto and the like on the grounds that it would hurt business (of course, I could be wrong; like I said, I don't follow politics much.) Honestly, I don't think the 'leading' countries really want things to change, and rather dread alternative energy sources. Heck, wasn't Bush's family wealthy because of oil? There's not really much incentive there to change things. I think that's what it all comes down to. The oil companies have too much power in the affairs of the state (and it's been so for a century), and too much prosperity is dependant on it. As such, it's lamentable, but things won't change till the oil dries up.

I'm not environmentalist, but I'm not comfortable with the whole oil industry. In this issue I'm rather against the Conservative platform, I think. They're too focussed on business, especially big business, and that's in fact one of the reasons I'm turning my back on engineering. I've become rather frustrated with how much seems to be geared towards money-making and 'success'. I don't know how things are going to turn out in the world, but I can say it sure as hell won't be the petroleum companies who are going to save it. (Admittedly, I actually worked in oil research as summer work last summer... actually rather an interesting job... but it doesn't change the fact that it's not good for the environment. It was a good job, no doubt - especially as it was geared to research and not money-making -  and there's something fun about having one's hands covered in raw bitumen, but still... I'm not comfortable with the outcome.)

Radical_Dreamer

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« Reply #55 on: March 19, 2006, 11:02:07 pm »
Petroleum is an finite resources. The fact that it's made out of dinosaurs should be a good hint as to the long term viability of the stuff. Of course, Big Oil (and yes, the wealth of the Bush family is derived from oil dealings) stand the most to benefit from alternative fuel resources, although they are too short-sighted, greedy, and stupid to realize it. Yes, it would require spending a lot of money up front, but it would pay for itself, and prolong the life of the companies. I'm not saying that that's neccisarily a good thing, but really, most people wouldn't care if they still went to Conoco-Philips or Shell for their alternative fuel. That's why the oil companies should be making the push. They already have the infrastructure.

Where I live, diesel fuel goes for about $2.70-2.90 a gallon. Biodiesel is between $3.00-$3.20. At the end of the year, I plan on purchasing a diesel vehicle. Hopefully by then, biodiesel will be even cheaper. Even if it isn't, the cost of using it is so trivially greater that it's damn near impossible to justify continuing to use petrolleum products. The alternative fuels are already here, they are already at the pump. It infuriates me that big oil isn't leaping all over this. There loss, because they are going to be losing me, and an ever increasing amount of customers to renewable fuels.

Actually, Daniel, you might be in a good position to find out about the hydrogen injectors with your contacts. The technology was developed in Canada.

GrayLensman

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« Reply #56 on: March 19, 2006, 11:39:20 pm »
Diesel is the way to go.

From what references I was able to find (Wikipedia), the HFI technology developed by Canadian Hydrogen Energy Company, LTD. provides a marginal reduction in fuel consumption and emissions.

I'm curious what the theoretical maximum efficiency afforded by HFI would be.

Daniel Krispin

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« Reply #57 on: March 20, 2006, 12:52:35 am »
Well, Engineering's not quite my thing anymore. I've sort of defected to Classics, so to speak. And next year, that'll be official.

GreenGannon

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« Reply #58 on: March 20, 2006, 01:44:28 am »
Yeah, but...Diesel smells.

Radical_Dreamer

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« Reply #59 on: March 20, 2006, 01:52:17 am »
Quote from: GreenGannon
Yeah, but...Diesel smells.


If you use petroleum diesel, yes. Biodiesel exhaust, by all accounts, smells like french fries. In fact, in some rural areas, it's attracted bears to garages. The solution to this, by the way, is hanging balloons filled with amonia and dipped in biodiesel. It teaches the bears to disassociate the smell of biodiesel with potential food.