Stuff you hate

[Mr Bekkler]

Saj, that reminded me of the following line that you might find interesting: "When you're a kid, they tell you it's all 'grow up. Get a job. Get married. Get a house. Have a kid, and that's it.' But the truth is, the world is so much stranger than that. It's so much darker. And so much madder. And so much better."

You and the Doctor!

[Syna]

I'm not even going to go into that whole "the two characters knew each other for about three weeks and fell head over heels in love" fairytale bullshit.

You know, I agree with you, and to extend your rant a bit, I wish people were more realistic about this. The truth is, I think, that so-called "love at first sight" does kind of happen, but it's more like this: you see someone, and you interact a bit with them, and your intuition tells you that you can forge a connection. It's more like "I could love this person" than "I love this person." And because you can be very, very wrong about this, it's not easy and straightforward and it does often take ages to sort out what it all means. It's a beautiful experience and it really does occur, but it's just as convoluted as any other romantic relationship or friendship.

See, to me, a story where people do feel and instantaneous connection but muddle through the quagmire of doubt and awkwardness and general weirdness sounds way more compelling than bam bam hearts and flowers. (ETA: Or, optionally, it's bam bam hearts and flowers and then she gets sucked through a time gate. ^_~) But some people aren't too fond of real complexity, I guess.

[Sajainta]

Saj, that reminded me of the following line that you might find interesting: "When you're a kid, they tell you it's all 'grow up. Get a job. Get married. Get a house. Have a kid, and that's it.' But the truth is, the world is so much stranger than that. It's so much darker. And so much madder. And so much better."

That is an amazing quote.  So true.

You and the Doctor!

He's a JaWHOva's Witness, do you expect anything else?  XP

You know, I agree with you, and to extend your rant a bit, I wish people were more realistic about this. The truth is, I think, that so-called "love at first sight" does kind of happen, but it's more like this: you see someone, and you interact a bit with them, and your intuition tells you that you can forge a connection. It's more like "I could love this person" than "I love this person." And because you can be very, very wrong about this, it's not easy and straightforward and it does often take ages to sort out what it all means. It's a beautiful experience and it really does occur, but it's just as convoluted as any other romantic relationship or friendship.

I've had that happen before on both a friendship and on a relationship level, when I've met someone and within the first few hours of talking with them have thought "I can see us being best friends" or (in the case of my boyfriend) "I can see myself loving him".  But wouldn't that just be intuition at first sight?  I wouldn't say it was "love" at first sight, because I don't like using the word "love" lightly.  It is such a deep and moving feeling-that-isn't-really-a-feeling that ages and matures with time and does not happen in a matter of moments.  Not to mention that part of being in love is truly knowing another human being, something that cannot happen quickly.

I see what you're saying, and I do know those moments exist because I've experienced them.  And correctly too, yay!  That "I could love you" feeling I had around that one guy with tousled brown hair and glasses led me into a wonderful relationship with him, and we'll celebrate our four year anniversary in three days.  =)  But I would still hesitate to call it love, purely because I think love in this context is a special word that should not be taken lightly.  Does that make sense?

See, to me, a story where people do feel and instantaneous connection but muddle through the quagmire of doubt and awkwardness and general weirdness sounds way more compelling than bam bam hearts and flowers. (ETA: Or, optionally, it's bam bam hearts and flowers and then she gets sucked through a time gate. ^_~) But some people aren't too fond of real complexity, I guess.

Agreed 100%!

[Syna]

 But wouldn't that just be intuition at first sight?  I wouldn't say it was "love" at first sight, because I don't like using the word "love" lightly.  It is such a deep and moving feeling-that-isn't-really-a-feeling that ages and matures with time and does not happen in a matter of moments.

Oh, yes, I certainly agree that "love" is deserving of a more lasting and deep connection, and needs to be earned, kind of.

That instantaneous recognition of the possibility of love is a really amazing (and sometimes alarming) experience in its own right, but it's just that-- the possibility of love.

I think people jump to the word love because they desperately want to experience the most meaningful and intense experiences life has to offer, and that's understandable; but IMHO that's because infatuation gets a bad rap. It's pretty fucking awesome when you're infatuated with someone! It's just not love yet.

(I admit to being a bit biased here because my own boyfriend of almost 4 years claims up and down that it was love at first sight for him, but I think he ultimately agrees with what we're saying. "Love at first sight" just makes a good story to tell friends maybe. ^^ And for my part, I experienced what you did, "wow this is someone I could really be connected to." )

Not to mention that part of being in love is truly knowing another human being, something that cannot happen quickly.

On one hand, I definitely agree with this, but to extend the discussion a bit, I tend to think mystery is a crucial aspect of love. Not that you don't know the person, but I'm inclined to say that part of what you know is how deep and, in certain ways, unknowable they are. Having an SO for this long, I'm in no hurry to know everything about him. I enjoy the process of discovery. Just idle thoughts, though. 

[tushantin]

XD Did somebody say "Love at first sight"? Funny thing is (I'm not trying to be sexist, if discriminating your own sex is sexist, just that it's a psychological fact) most guys, upon meeting a girl, make up their mind at first sight (or meeting) whether the girl they saw was "doable". Romance and intimate relationships come after, let alone any kind of tension.

Personally, I've always seen true love as something "fun". When you really LOVE someone you'd have the best time with them, more than anybody else in the whole wide world. Doesn't mean you don't fight, of course (which was modestly pointed out by Saj XDDD), but life happens when you least expect it. But when things go quite unhealthy and there's not much you can do to improve it, and nor is your partner interested in cooperating, it's time  to leave the building before you damage yourself emotionally (yes, I've been there, and it's not pretty; thus I've vowed to never be bound to relationship again, and have romance while still having freedom, being infidel to my heart's content and be honest about it to those I love).

I recall a chick named Marianne, and boy what a hotty she was! She was actually my good friend's sister, so I didn't say things out loud lest I damage the friendship. Frankly, me and the blonde never got along (also, she was from Glasgow, not that it mattered besides the point that we knew we'd never see each other again, me being Indian and all, while she'd stay for only six months or more). We fought; each time she saw me she'd frown and remark offensively about my looks or personality, and I did the same. We had completely different tastes, we cared about completely different things, our thought wavelengths were, you guessed it, completely different, and she was physically violent! o__o" She'd hit me with a frying pan when cooking, a wrench when she's fixing her brother's bike, pummel me with books if I didn't agree with her, and once even tossed an armchair at me!

The main cause for her strength was her brother teaching her Jiu Jitsu in order to help her defend herself against thieves and sorts. But it looked like I was also categorized as a "villain" in her book, while I often called her a "witch". But I don't really know what happened one day, as out of the blue, she kissed me.

Things seemed to tense up after that. She hated me even more than before, ignored me, and at the same time I couldn't stand her nerves. Then she came one day AGAIN when nobody was around, kept her head on my shoulder and fell asleep. Hell she even named me after a bird I kept one rainy day, saying that only she was allowed to "call me by such an adorable name."

It's a bit complicated to explain, but we were actually close friends. Pretty close. Really, really close. Turns out she mocked me because she had fun doing it and that she liked me, while I teased her to get back at her, coz she's a brat, and also partially because I couldn't really express how I felt about her. Hell, we knew each other more than we knew ourselves, and shared so much not an ordinary bloke would share with a mere friend. I still remember those blue eyes I found myself lost in, and the smell of her neck, the feeling of her hair... Hearts pounded, words left unsaid...

Too bad I can't see her ever again. It's already been years now, and she's probably moved on with her life.

Oh well, how about paneer tonight! *rubs his hands*

[Lord J Esq]

You certainly have a creative imagination!

I wonder where you came across the word "chick" in that context. That has a disparaging connotation you might not be aware of. "The blonde" is also pretty dubious.

[tushantin]

You certainly have a creative imagination!

I wonder where you came across the word "chick" in that context. That has a disparaging connotation you might not be aware of. "The blonde" is also pretty dubious.

You have every right to be dubious (I think that means doubtful?) for this is internet, after all.

She did name me after a bird, a nickname which is also my penname today (I'm not going to say "what" that name is yet; I'd like to surprise her out of the blue when I publish the book), and the wounds of that frying pan and stick still ache my bones at the thought. @_@" I remember she'd kick me if I was down and wouldn't stop until I'm in good spirits again. Well, that's her way to care about people I suppose. XD

Also, the term "chick" may not be common for folks in my city (over 90% would rather speak in Hindi/Marathi), but it's a habit Harry placed on me, and I admit I caught on to his style of speech. It's not really offensive if you say the word in front of girls you know and respect, at least not where I'm at. As for "The Blonde", let's just say she's one of the few Blonde's I've actually ever seen with my own eyes. xP


P.S.: One thing I would like to apologize for is the way I dramatize (is that a word?) everything. It's actually the way I look at the world. XDDD It's one helluva crazy story.

[Sajainta]

On one hand, I definitely agree with this, but to extend the discussion a bit, I tend to think mystery is a crucial aspect of love. Not that you don't know the person, but I'm inclined to say that part of what you know is how deep and, in certain ways, unknowable they are. Having an SO for this long, I'm in no hurry to know everything about him. I enjoy the process of discovery. Just idle thoughts, though.  

I completely agree with you.  I think that the more you know someone, the more you realize just how much there is to discover about them, and the more you realize just how fascinating and deeply-layered they are.

XD Did somebody say "Love at first sight"? Funny thing is (I'm not trying to be sexist, if discriminating your own sex is sexist, just that it's a psychological fact) most guys, upon meeting a girl, make up their mind at first sight (or meeting) whether the girl they saw was "doable". Romance and intimate relationships come after, let alone any kind of tension.

Knew that.  I think that's pretty common knowledge.  Contrary to popular belief, I know quite a few women who do the same thing when they meet men.

Personally, I've always seen true love as something "fun". When you really LOVE someone you'd have the best time with them, more than anybody else in the whole wide world. Doesn't mean you don't fight, of course (which was modestly pointed out by Saj XDDD), but life happens when you least expect it.

Well yes, love can be very fun and you do have a great time / the best time ever with them, but I would never describe love as "fun" because to me that brings connotations of love somehow being easy and silly, which is just untrue.  I'm not trying to be a pessimist, but loving someone can be very difficult and very frustrating.  It is not easy.  It can certainly be a blast, I won't deny that.  My boyfriend is my best friend and I have more fun with him than anyone else.  But too many people fall under the fairytale assumption that love is easy and nice and safe, and then are in for a rude wake up call when they realize they're wrong.  Love is great.  It's fantastic.  But it isn't easy.

[ZeaLitY]

I hate limits. If I really wanted to go all in and destroy sexism, I'd need to make a lot of important plans for my future set on amassing the most power and influence possible to do the most good. And that would lead to the furloughing of several of my personal ambitions for happiness in this life. Don't get me wrong; improving humanity is one of my dreams, but it's not the only one.

I arise in the morning torn between a desire to improve the world and a desire to enjoy the world. This makes it hard to plan the day.

In my case, it's existentially paralyzed me. I can't plan beyond getting the experience of living in another country. It's like a war of selfishness and ethics; how selfish will I allow myself to be while still considering myself an ethical person? Every moment for my happiness is one stolen from the illumination of humanity. What kind of person will either path make me become? Damn. I hope being in Europe 3 months helps me think about this...

[Trebuchet]

Well said, Z. I have so many ambitions that I can't fit them into my short life.

[Syna]

Knew that.  I think that's pretty common knowledge.  Contrary to popular belief, I know quite a few women who do the same thing when they meet men.

Pretty much!

 But too many people fall under the fairytale assumption that love is easy and nice and safe, and then are in for a rude wake up call when they realize they're wrong.  Love is great.  It's fantastic.  But it isn't easy.

Yeah, it's like Thought's quote: everything is so much scarier and darker and more frustrating and difficult than you could ever imagine; and why would you want it to be any differently? If you're going to grapple, really grapple, with the presence of the soul of another person in all its complexity, struggle is inevitable.

Every moment for my happiness is one stolen from the illumination of humanity.

Those are intertwined goals, I think. You make humanity better by living a meaningful life. But maybe that's my copout answer; I think about that dilemma a lot myself. But I do believe that improving the world at the expense of a meaningful life is tragic, not a grand sacrifice.

[ZeaLitY]

Damn...

I know there's some optimal solution, too, but like they say, the only way to give 110% is to have luck on your side. (Yeah, ripped it off from Fallout 3.)

I guess I just find it hard to ethically live with myself, in that case. It's hard to champion some cause like a hero, when it's subordinate to your personal ambitions...

[tushantin]

I arise in the morning torn between a desire to improve the world and a desire to enjoy the world. This makes it hard to plan the day.

In my case, it's existentially paralyzed me. I can't plan beyond getting the experience of living in another country. It's like a war of selfishness and ethics; how selfish will I allow myself to be while still considering myself an ethical person? Every moment for my happiness is one stolen from the illumination of humanity. What kind of person will either path make me become? Damn. I hope being in Europe 3 months helps me think about this...

Gawddarvit! That's exactly the way I've been feeling! Just as I mentioned a friend, "the world tells me I'm not working hard enough if I have to achieve my goals whether I like it or not, but my soul tells me I'm working too hard and that I should chill out and enjoy the fruits of life. Art demands patience, but I'm not really rich enough to stay patient and think things over with calm mind. No matter how much time I make, I still keep getting distracted and frustrated, which eventually resulted in destroying my focus and capabilities to remember things well. Walking a thin line between selfishness and ethics, I feel like a ridiculous excuse for a human being.

But even this worthless human being isn't giving up; not till I'm drained of every last breath in me. Every person sees one side of truth without being able to see another, thus I have no intention of changing people's mentality, but rather point out the world's flaws and beauty in satires or artistic, entertaining way.

Just hope luck favors ya, mate! You've got lotsa things to do and even more things to see.  The universe is a pretty gigantic ballroom and beauties lay mysterious behind masks, waiting for their gentlemen to find them and dance with em.

@Syna: Sorry, I just got a bit worried. XD Although I do know some awesome stories outside cinemas starring chicks, almost any "movie" I've known of the same kind actually was a chick flick, so I'm sorry if I unintentionally offended someone. I'll take a look at this Black Swan.


And now for my own rant...

Ah, an aspiring animator's biggest dilemma! I really REALLY love 2D animation, but each time I visualize a scene it's from a 3D perspective with cameras moving in ways which are impossible to implement in any 2D production. I try my best to integrate them both at the same time, but in vain. I really wonder how the Japanese/Dreamworks do it. I really wonder how Ghost in the Shell - Stand Alone Complex was made.

Speaking of which, Gurren Lagann didn't use any 3D-mode and still pulled off realistic and interactive environments. Problem is that it was a big budget anime. XDDD I'm just one man with zero budget!

[Syna]

"the world tells me I'm not working hard enough if I have to achieve my goals whether I like it or not, but my soul tells me I'm working too hard and that I should chill out and enjoy the fruits of life. Art demands patience, but I'm not really rich enough to stay patient and think things over with calm mind. No matter how much time I make, I still keep getting distracted and frustrated, which eventually resulted in destroying my focus and capabilities to remember things well.

I feel you here, with the distractibility and the need for time you don't get to develop your art. I also struggle a lot between goalseeking and chilling out -- not just in the whole "the world wants me to spin my wheels" kind of way, though the world certainly does; but even in terms of my own goals... I have so many dreams and aspirations, but sometimes they feel cumbersome. What's the point if you aren't enjoying those fruits of life? I don't want goalseeking to get in the way of living-- but life doesn't feel complete or fully worthwhile without those goals.

Even if I wanted to be focused on achieving goals, I would be too distracted by my love of life to do so; even if I wanted to be completely content with everyday life, I'd still be restless as hell. Not precisely what you guys are talking about, but I think it's related.

This lecture on everyday happiness vs. satisfaction crystallizes it all for me--
http://www.ted.com/talks/view/id/779

But perhaps this is okay; in the words of William Blake, "without contraries there is no progression."

And yay for life-as-a-masquerade-- I quite agree! Perhaps the key is to enjoy it all for the roaring, messy, blistering drama that it is. The Hindu model of life as a cosmic play makes more and more sense to me these days.

@Syna: Sorry, I just got a bit worried. XD Although I do know some awesome stories outside cinemas starring chicks, almost any "movie" I've known of the same kind actually was a chick flick, so I'm sorry if I unintentionally offended someone. I'll take a look at this Black Swan.

It's no problem, it was just worded a bit unfortunately. ^^ From what you've said, I think you will enjoy the movie!

[tushantin]

But perhaps this is okay; in the words of William Blake, "without contraries there is no progression."

Finally! A William Blake fan at the Compendium! (Besides Thought and me, of course) 8D

I guess one of my biggest frustrations is my is my incapability to remember things, which now even hinders my creativity. I'm a person of thought, running a chain of analysis and philosophies through observations in my mind, but when all is done I kinda... forget everything. Nevertheless, certain fragments of conclusion remain in my subconsciousness, while I intuitively appreciate what life's actually about. For instance, I never study for exams, can't remember anything I studied; I just KNOW what's correct and what's wrong, and I've forgotten how I knew it in the first place.

But still, certain of Blake's verses do inspire me though:

Love seeketh not Itself to please,
Nor for itself hath any care;
But for another gives its ease,
And builds a Heaven in Hell’s despair.