Defense of Zenan Bridge

[ZeaLitY]

Yes; the endings are for humor or fun 'what-if' purposes only. In the grand scheme of things, the Epoch was probably not crashed, Magus lives, Lara gets her legs back, and Crono has 11 cats that escape at the Moonlight Parade.

[Akuma]

Well magic is almost required to defeat Zombor, so unless some strange force was involved here, Zenan Bridge would've fell.

Magus lives huh? That's why we see Frog as a human in the anime cut scene? That's also why Guile is not Magus. Because Magus lived.

Maybe Magil in Radical Dreamers is some form of Magus living in a timeline.

[ZeaLitY]

Magil is Magus himself; this is suggested in the game and verified by Masato Kato.

[Daggart]

I don't go for the Guile of chronocross = magus theory, but it is interesting that one of the big proofs I keep hearing against it is that Magus shouldn't be in that time period. If Magil of RD was supposed to be Magus than that proof doesnt mean much, heh. Just a thought.

I think its very possible there would have been no climactic fight on the bridge in the original timeline. In the original timeline, the queen wasn't found by Crono. She was probably found by a large group of soldiers. I'd guess that someone, probably Frog, lead a massive strike against their hideout under the church and that thats where the bulk of the battle took place. If there was later a battle on the bridge it was probably much smaller in scope.

[Faulce]

How would leading a massive strike on the Cathedral have any effect on the Zenan Bridge battle?  Yakra and co. are just a small castle infiltration group, their purpose is to draw some attention away from Magus and the war directly.  They kidnap the Queen (and some soldiers if you remember) along with Yakra posing as the Chancellor, probably to subtly influence the King into making small poor decisions here and there that end up costing the humans the war.  The Zenan Bridge battle is an actual attack by Magus's troops under the command of Ozzie to secure the bridge in the name of the Mystics and prepare for all out assault on Northern portion of the Zenan continent (Magus's troops have already taken over the Southern portion.  A child says that he can't play outside because of the 'monsters', suggesting that troops may be everywhere or at least freely roaming in small numbers.)  So the two circumstances would be unrelated, except that if the scheme of Yakra was not found out, the battle may have been postponed.

[Daggart]

When Crono and Lucca went to the church, there were a few 'nun's there, probably keeping watch. A boy and a girl probably wern't consitered much threat. They kill off these watchmen and enter the church area, mostly unnoticed.

If the search hadn't officially been stopped, I imagine the mystics would have reacted to a large group of troups laying siege to their hideout to find their Queen much differently than a couple of kids of no importance. I imagine they would have better fortified the area with their men instead of leaving it so poorly defended.  They would have less people to lead a strike on the bridge. Maybe, they would even descide against it.

EDIT: Aack! I was remembering my chrono map wrong. I was thinking the cathedral was on the continent below the bridge, not on Zenan. I guess in light of that, what I was saying makes no sense at all. My mistake ^^;

[Faulce]

Well magic is almost required to defeat Zombor, so unless some strange force was involved here, Zenan Bridge would've fell.

If you remember, Zombor only appeared after Ozzie became pissed off at Crono and co. for bustin up him and his troops.  The mystics (or at least Ozzie and Magus) new that magic was required to defeat Zombor, so why would they not just send it out across the bridge to decimate the kingdom?  In light of this, only two possibilities (that I can think of now) make sense to me. (1) The mystics must have won the Zenan Bridge battle. If the humans some how attained the upperhand, Ozzie would have released Zombor to finish them off, secure the bridge and have him along with other Mystic troops prepare for a full scale invasion with the Zenan Bridge being the "camp" for the invasion.  After Magus "disappeared" (as it would have appeared to the Mystics), the Mystics lost morale and ended up slowly pulling back as the now rallied and confident humans stepped up to oppose the remaining threat.  Remember that everything in the game is somewhat scaled down - from the number of people you see in towns, to the size of the towns themselves.   (In CC,  El Nido is tiny in comparison with Zenan so its logical that large cities were shrunken to village size [just as Crono and co. are turned into giants on the world map, all of it is for player convenience])  So there were probably many more soldiers, both at the Bridge, and in general, than were shown.
              OR
(2) With all hope gone, the remaining knights of the Square Table (heh) destroyed the Zenan Bridge, forfeiting the southern continent in order to save the kingdom as a whole.  The Mystic rule in the south continued, as well as the war.  Dorino (sp?) was destroyed along with Fiona's Villa and her forest (hence why they dont exist in the Present. I doubt that Dorino was 'abandoned' due the deforestation because even after the Sunken Desert sidequest, Dorino does not exist in 1000 A.D.)  Battles were probably being fought in Porre just as Magus "disappeared".  Here the mystics lost heart and pulled back (maybe this is where Porre's military history began!?!).  Afterwards, humans sealed up the cave leading to Magus's Castle (as it is not accesible in 1000 A.D., unless Heckran cave has something to do with it.) and humans claimed victory.
(I think option 2 is more likely)

[chronotriggerfreak]

Wow. The crazy thing is, that second option makes perfect sense to me and explains exactly why San Dorino is missing in 1000 A.D. (I could never figure this out before.)

[Faulce]

San Dorino! thats what its called.  good. Yea the only problem with my second option hypothesis is that it doesnt really explain why San Dorino doesnt exist in 1000 A.D. AFTER Crono defeats Zombor on the Zenan Bridge.  Crono and co. secure the Bridge for the humans and go to Denadoro mts to get the Masamune.  Then they leave for awhile to get the Masamune repaired (but no mystic attack occurs in this timeframe because when the party returns to 600 A.D., San Dorino still exists).  Then the party storms the castle, defeats Magus and leaves 600 A.D. for awhile again (still no mystic attack on San Dorino, everything seems hunky-dory).
Basically the game offers no obvious or easily discoverable sublte solution to why San Dorino does not exist in 1000 A.D.   I can, however, think of 3 possibilities for its non existence in the altered 1000 A.D.
(1) The 'war' between the mystics and humans had been going on for quite awhile, but it was only when Magus assumed power that true war began.  Perhaps San Dorino was the victim of some giant hate crime against humans by the remaining mystic extremists or perhaps it was destroyed much later by mystics from Medina for similar reasons.  These situations are unlikely as they would have started another war (perhaps there was one large battle in 712 A.D. or something that wasnt mentioned in the game with the humans coming out victorious, but there just isnt any support for this possibility in the game).
(2)  Remeber the Cursed Woods and Guardia Forest? Yea monsters live in forests.  Perhaps with the spread of Fiona's woods, monsters or even just dangerous animals (bears, cougars, koalas) entered the town and messed with the citizens (probably children playing).  The town was most likely not destroyed by these creatures, the citizens probably moved out to Porre and Truce.  (Again this kinda makes sense, but the Curseed woods were close to Porre [though probably not as close as Fionas woods eventually were to San Dorino] and in 1000 A.D. forests are all around Truce.  But the creatures in the Cursed woods were significantly stronger and more dangerous than the birds and beetles of the Present, so perhaps this possibility is correct.
(3)  Being very close to Zenan Bridge, San Dorino either was or eventually developed an economy based on trade between Porre and Truce (perhaps they had delivery services, had inns and restaraunts for 'businessmen', had open markets for constant passerby travelers from the two towns, etc.)  But with the invention of the Ferry system, travel using the old Zenan Bridge began to die down significantly as tourists, vacationers and businessmen enjoyed quick and easy travel on the ferry from Porre to Truce and vice versa.  Kinda like how mom and pop stores lose business to the walmart next door, eventually the town failed and its citizens moved to Porre and Truce to take advantage of the markets in those towns or something.

[XchrononetX]

Exactly, it had to be because of tourism, or financial issues. Perhaps the Mayor, having given Toma so much money out of sheer desperation to find the Ranbow Shell, had actually given him VITAL money for the prosperity of the city/town. That could possibly explain its lack of existence in 1000 AD. I always thought it was simply an issue of finance rather than an issue of attack on the village itself.

[Epsilon]

King Guardia XXIII rasied taxes so much that the town of San Dorino couldnt pay them, and in retaliation the corrupt King destroyed the town completely...

Well, we dont know anything about the Kings between 600 and 1000...

[Faulce]

I can agree with XchrononetX, but i dont know about you Epsilon. lol. there is zero support or even implication that he raised taxes to that high of a level, or even at all, though i do see where you were going.
So basically, the scared mayor who spent a huge chunk of the towns money, and the later developed ferry system of travel screwed over San Dorino.  Can we all agree to that?

[Epsilon]

Well, the town lost alot of gold... maybe the Mayor needed the money back ( He seemed very angry tyhat he had lost the money in the first place) and tryed to get money from his cictizens, who left in disgust, and eventually the town was grown over?

Actually, the ferry making the towns businesses collapse or forced to move to Truce / Porre makes more sense..

Hm, a thoguht... San Dorino sounds spanish... yet Truce is an English word.. anyone know anything about where the name Porre originated?

[Faulce]

Yes Truce is English and San Dorino is Spanish.  All I found regarding Porre is that Porrey is a German word.  Now what about Choras and Medina?  Medina is a "locality" in Saudi Arabia but is also the name of a "locality" in Western Australia.  Choras, i found meant chorus in lithuanian.  So perhaps choras is a russian word.  Strange how those town names worked out.  England, Spain, Germany, Saudi Arabia/Australia, Russia.

[chronotriggerfreak]

Unless Medina in Australia is some major cultural or religious center, I'm willing to bet the Medina in Chrono Trigger takes after the Arabian city. After all, if you think about it, the Mystics' Medina parallels the Arabians' Medina in importance and prestige.

As far as San Dorino's destruction in the Keystone timelines, well, the Human-Mystic war is not definitively over because Magus disappeared. In actuality, I always imagined--possibly because of some quote in the game, but I'm not sure--that the war went on strong for a while after, only slowly dwindling down because of the loss of their leader. So San Dorino may still be a casuality of the war, even if it is several weeks after Crono saves the Guardian armies at Zenan Bridge. As for Fiona's Villa, well, do you honestly think the Mystics ever thought, either before or after their defeat, that this single house in the middle of nowhere was worth destroying, if they bothered to notice it at all? It was probably the Zombor look-a-like's fault both in the Original and Keystone timelines, until the party takes care of that problem.