Author Topic: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).  (Read 2548 times)

Vallery

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Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« on: April 25, 2007, 01:12:57 pm »
I've only recently played through Chrono Cross in its entirety, and because of time contraints (400-level classes keep me too busy to have game-playing leisure time), I had to play through it reasonably fast over spring break.  I'm still having a bit of trouble understanding just who Kid is, and I was wondering if anyone would be willing to give me a brief (or not-so-brief, if that's what you'd prefer) summary of her character?

After reading all of the in-depth analysis of such small details in the story on these boards, I'm sure I'm probably making a fool of myself even coming here to ask this question.  But, I'm hoping that those who would be annoyed can ignore me, and those that are merciful will be willing to help me out.

Thank you!   :D

Kyronea

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2007, 02:42:26 pm »
Kid is a clone of Schala, sent out from the Darkness Beyond Time by Schala to do her bidding. She was found as a baby by Lucca in 1004 A.D. and was raised in the orphanage there. In 1020 A.D. before the dimensional split she went back in time with the help of Belthasar to save Serge and cause the dimensional split. Serge meets up with her in Another World a few days before that actual event and then proceeds through the adventures of the game from there.

She does possess Schala's amulet--a 13,000 years younger version of Marle's--which is programmed to send her back in time by a few minutes if she ever is seriously hurt. That's why she survives the incident where Lynx stabbed her without a scratch.

Any other questions about Kid?

ZeaLitY

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2007, 03:01:44 pm »
Well, rather than do her bidding, I'd say that Kid was a last ditch effort to preserve herself, since she made Kid shortly before her mind became totally bent on destruction thanks to the fusion with Lavos.

Kyronea

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2007, 03:04:28 pm »
Well, rather than do her bidding, I'd say that Kid was a last ditch effort to preserve herself, since she made Kid shortly before her mind became totally bent on destruction thanks to the fusion with Lavos.
Aye, there is that. Same basic thing, though...Kid is doing what Schala wants Kid to do.

Vallery

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2007, 06:21:55 pm »
How did she come into contact with Belthasar?
(Ps. Thank you so much for your replies!)

Kyronea

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2007, 06:26:40 pm »
How did she come into contact with Belthasar?
(Ps. Thank you so much for your replies!)
Presumeably Belthesar contacted Kid, not the other way around. As for how exactly he did it...well, we do seem him posing as a scholar in Viper Mansion, so he may have met with her in person...if I were Belthesar it's what I would do, if I was going to try to convince someone with as strong a personality as Kid about time travel and saving Serge.

Zaperking

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2007, 10:51:43 pm »
Kid isn't a true "clone" of Schala.
Kid is unique from Schala. Kidd has a different hair color, bordering orange, and her eye color is different. Also, her personality is way unpolished compared to Schala.
However, Schala magically created Kid in a last ditch effort, as Zeality said, to preserve her sanity/good side before Lavos could fully integrate with her mind.

Kid is used by Belthasar to achieve his plan. In the original CC timeline, Serge died, but Kid was sent out of the DBT regardless. Sometime after 1020, Belthasar met her and told her to go back in time, to 1020 to call Serge into Another World. Supposedly, when Kid did this, she left and went back to her time, and then the Kid from the current period arrived at the scene to meet Serge (probably as a coincidence as she was investigating into Lucca's death).

Kid lives on to avenge Lucca's death, as she was found and raised by Lucca as a baby after Schala sent her from the DBT.
Kid cannot die as Schala's pendant sends her back into the immediate past before she is killed (that or she is teleported somewhere else because otherwise there would just be a loop if she went back in time, and got killed again lol).

@ Kyronea - Marle's pendant isn't the same as Schala's. Marle's pendant is Schala's pendant from the original timeline, a pendant that had all of it's power drained, and we do not know any of the details how Schala lost it etc. However, Kids pendant is Schala's pendant from the altered timeline, where Schala fell into the DBT. I hypothesized that being in contact with Lavos and the Mammon Machine as she fell in, her amulet was probably overwhelmed in Lavos' power or something, and thats why it's even more different than the first.

Kyronea

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2007, 11:11:07 pm »
Kid isn't a true "clone" of Schala.
Yes she is.
Quote
Kid is unique from Schala. Kidd has a different hair color, bordering orange, and her eye color is different. Also, her personality is way unpolished compared to Schala.
Irrelevant. Study genetics...personality is mostly determined by upbringing rather than one's DNA. A clone of Schala will not be identical to Schala unless Schala's conciousness was somehow downloaded into the clone's brain. As for the hair colour, it's also possible a slightly different gene was expressed in this clone, or the cloning process wasn't entirely perfect.
Quote
However, Schala magically created Kid in a last ditch effort, as Zeality said, to preserve her sanity/good side before Lavos could fully integrate with her mind.
Aye.
Quote
@ Kyronea - Marle's pendant isn't the same as Schala's. Marle's pendant is Schala's pendant from the original timeline, a pendant that had all of it's power drained, and we do not know any of the details how Schala lost it etc. However, Kids pendant is Schala's pendant from the altered timeline, where Schala fell into the DBT. I hypothesized that being in contact with Lavos and the Mammon Machine as she fell in, her amulet was probably overwhelmed in Lavos' power or something, and thats why it's even more different than the first.
Certainly possible. Still, we've seen no evidence that it is truly different apart from having the power it does, which may have been imbued by Schala herself as a safety measure. That said, you're definitely right about it being from an alternate timeline, but then so is most of the equipment Crono and the gang possessed, so it's essentially irrelevant.

ZeaLitY

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2007, 12:48:10 am »
Before pendant confusion takes place, I'm going to kill the discussion with this:

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Pendant_Paradox_%28Reasons_for%29.html

And please note that it isn't a real paradox. It is explained. "Paradox" is just the name for it.

Kyronea

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2007, 12:59:13 am »
Before pendant confusion takes place, I'm going to kill the discussion with this:

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Pendant_Paradox_%28Reasons_for%29.html

And please note that it isn't a real paradox. It is explained. "Paradox" is just the name for it.
I knew that...I simply thought it already understood and thus did not need to be invoked.

Zaperking

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2007, 04:33:33 am »
Kid isn't a true "clone" of Schala.
Yes she is.
Quote
Kid is unique from Schala. Kidd has a different hair color, bordering orange, and her eye color is different. Also, her personality is way unpolished compared to Schala.
Irrelevant. Study genetics...personality is mostly determined by upbringing rather than one's DNA. A clone of Schala will not be identical to Schala unless Schala's conciousness was somehow downloaded into the clone's brain. As for the hair colour, it's also possible a slightly different gene was expressed in this clone, or the cloning process wasn't entirely perfect.
Quote
However, Schala magically created Kid in a last ditch effort, as Zeality said, to preserve her sanity/good side before Lavos could fully integrate with her mind.
Aye.
Quote
@ Kyronea - Marle's pendant isn't the same as Schala's. Marle's pendant is Schala's pendant from the original timeline, a pendant that had all of it's power drained, and we do not know any of the details how Schala lost it etc. However, Kids pendant is Schala's pendant from the altered timeline, where Schala fell into the DBT. I hypothesized that being in contact with Lavos and the Mammon Machine as she fell in, her amulet was probably overwhelmed in Lavos' power or something, and thats why it's even more different than the first.
Certainly possible. Still, we've seen no evidence that it is truly different apart from having the power it does, which may have been imbued by Schala herself as a safety measure. That said, you're definitely right about it being from an alternate timeline, but then so is most of the equipment Crono and the gang possessed, so it's essentially irrelevant.

I'm just going to say that it's really retarded and arbitrary how you keep saying everything is "irrelevant" when the pendant and Kid's demeanor is related to the explanation of Kid -.-

That being said, Kid isn't Schala's true clone because she is stated to also be her daughter.
Furthermore, Kid is different because CC's main motif is that thing in the end will come back together to form a whole (with the completion of Project Kid). Schala in the DBT isn't a whole anymore, and supposedly Kid and her will recombine at the end of the game, thats what most gamers think anyway, otherwise the story wouldn't end, especially with all the evidence backing up the merger.
Kid isn't just some doppleganger, the game makes that very clear. However, she is definitely a missing piece of Schala (lol, that would tie in so well with the motif of the missing piece in CC + the picture book lol)

ZeaLitY

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2007, 02:53:36 pm »
We can all think what we want, but until hard canonical evidence goes either way, we don't know the final outcome of the Kid and Schala situation. We see Kid sailing out of El Nido, and we also see what appears to be Schala standing on the beach. This cut scene evidence and the fact that someone is married to Serge while the other is searching leaves the matter completely open.

grey_the_angel

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2007, 04:30:04 pm »
guys guys we all know the answer to this question:

.
.
.
.
.
A wizard did it.

Kyronea

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2007, 04:49:35 pm »

I'm just going to say that it's really retarded and arbitrary how you keep saying everything is "irrelevant" when the pendant and Kid's demeanor is related to the explanation of Kid -.-
No, it isn't "retarded" and "arbitrary." I said study genetics...understand how it works and maybe you'll figure out it's not actually arbitrary.

Quote
That being said, Kid isn't Schala's true clone because she is stated to also be her daughter.
A clone can be someone's daughter. Without the use of technology to speed aging, any clone will be born as an infant, not fully grown, and thus can be said to be the child of the cloned person.
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Furthermore, Kid is different because CC's main motif is that thing in the end will come back together to form a whole (with the completion of Project Kid).
Perhaps.
Quote
Schala in the DBT isn't a whole anymore, and supposedly Kid and her will recombine at the end of the game, thats what most gamers think anyway, otherwise the story wouldn't end, especially with all the evidence backing up the merger.
It doesn't matter what "most gamers think." What matters are the facts. Nothing states that Schala is not whole while living in the DBT. She is stated to be going insane and becoming a wretched individual due to the corruption on her mind the Lavos half of the Time Devourer exerts, but nothing ever states she is not whole.
Quote
Kid isn't just some doppleganger, the game makes that very clear. However, she is definitely a missing piece of Schala (lol, that would tie in so well with the motif of the missing piece in CC + the picture book lol)
She doesn't have to be a doppelganger. You seem to be misinterpreting what clone really means. All it means is that the person is a copy of another person's DNA; nothing more. They don't have to be identical, or a missing piece of that person, or anything else. They simply share DNA. Kid is a completely different person from Schala, because she was raised differently, in a different timeline and different era of history. While I agree it would be "artful" if Kid were a missing piece of Schala, nothing states that she is. She certainly doesn't believe it herself, given her constant cries of being her own person.

Chrono'99

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Re: Kid explanation (I'm a n00b).
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2007, 06:25:55 pm »
This cut scene evidence and the fact that someone is married to Serge while the other is searching leaves the matter completely open.

I thought it was obvious that the photograph was taken after Schala, Kid, or Schala Kid, had found and married Serge. I mean, this is the only logical explanation.

So, the Kid on the boat cutscene seems to be the only piece of evidence which could support the non-merging theory.