Cursed Masamune

[secondrate]

Back at the Ocean Palace, the CT team had no time to recover the sword after it was used on the Mammon Machine- Lavos was summoned. And during the scene, when the CT team are teleported back to the Mammon Machine, the sword is nowhere to be seen. I assumed that Magus' red-colored weapon was Doreen, and it too shared the same fate as Masamune.

[Avalon]

Hmm, I always assumed that it was some magical backhand of doom, but I suppose the red glow could have been a dreamstone weapon. As for Masa and Mune, if your theory stands any merit, once it hits 600 AD, would they be unabsorbed due to Time Bastard (If I've got the concept right, since Frog took them with him on his time traveling adventures, come his return to 600 ad after leaving the Masamune in the Mamon Machine, the Masamune that had been absorbed would have been annihilated, but hey, I'm new.)

[secondrate]

I believe that the Dreamstone (of which Masamune was forged with) is the cause of it's existence after time was altered in the Dark Ages. Its as if The Entity preserved the natural flow of time through the Dreamstone, and Lavos only temporarily altered time. But, in doing so, creating an alternate Masamune by taking it with him to DBT during that time.

Or...

The Dreamstone, of which the CT team acquired in the Prehistoric Era, was initially used to forge the Masamune in the Dark Ages. This wouldn't effect the natural timeline, since time had already passed to the Present. So instead, a time relapse occurs in which Lavos intends to change the past. But then I wonder...what would make that piece of Dreamstone so special? Maybe I'm thinking too much...

[V_Translanka]

I always thought the red weapon Magus used was the (newly formed) Masamune and that they show it as red so that you realize that it's the Masamune (because otherwise it'd just look like any other weapon's animation)...*shrugs* The Masamune seems like the only thing he'd think would "work" on Lavos...I mean, he knows that the Masamune absorbs his M. Def and that it seemed to absorb the energy from the Mammon Machine...both of which were Magic-inclined things and thus linked to Lavos (& thus linked back to the Entity/planet, of course...DREAMSTONE CIRCLE OF MAGIC LIFE?!? >_>)...

[Thought]

Huh. I suppose Lavos could have "absorbed" the sword, but why?

I always assumed that after Lavos was summoned, the sword was supposed to be like Schala's original pendant; lost to the ages (until someone finally found it). But, as asked above, why would Lavos have bothered to absorb the sword assuming it wasn't lost (and, more importantly, could it have?)

As for Magus' weapon, I assume that we are talking about the scythe that he attacked Lavos with (and the one that produced that fun glow that for a moment makes it look like he dramatically cut off Lavos' "lead"), correct? Is there any indication that this is anything other than just a random blade? Doesn't seem like this could be the Masamune, as why would Magus plot to raise Lavos just to hope to find a weapon there? His plans would have presumably included making sure he had a weapon (still might be made of dreamstone, I suppose, as he could have had access to the laboratories of the three gurus). If Dreamstone is a conduit for power, then that might explain the seeming power drain that Magus undergoes a few seconds after his attack.

[Boo the Gentleman Caller]

I always assumed that after Lavos was summoned, the sword was supposed to be like Schala's original pendant; lost to the ages (until someone finally found it).

This was always my thought on the Masamune.

And my thoughts towards Magus' red scythe was that all of his magical prowess was focused into his weapon, and that Magus was performing a do-or-die maneuver.  Obviously, it fails, and when we next see Magus (at the North Cape) his magical powers and stats have been greatly reduced to average levels.

[V_Translanka]

Well, no, Lavos seems to drain Magus...he even references this, doesn't he? I haven't gotten there in the Retranslation, though & don't feel like looking it up...>_>

[secondrate]

Huh. I suppose Lavos could have "absorbed" the sword, but why?

I always assumed that after Lavos was summoned, the sword was supposed to be like Schala's original pendant; lost to the ages (until someone finally found it). But, as asked above, why would Lavos have bothered to absorb the sword assuming it wasn't lost (and, more importantly, could it have?)

Masamune obviously made contact with the Mammon Machine at some point during the Dark Ages. It was Melchoir's intention to actually use it to destroy the thing. There's no floating kingdom of Zeal in the beginning of the game. There's no Black Omen or Ocean Palace, neither. On top of that, Lavos isn't dead, because he shows up in 1999 AD. The three Gurus and Janus must have been warped before the Masamune was used on the Mammon Machine, otherwise it would contradict the above.

If the piece of Dreamstone from the Prehistoric Era was made into the Masamune in the Dark Ages, then Masamune's power must have weakened when the CT team took it with them. This would also lead to a different scenario in the Dark Ages. But, if this were true, then the broken sword would've dissapeared (which it doesn't) and the Black Omen would appear in all the time lines (which it doesn't) *unless* something along the lines of what you said, as well as the destruction of the Mammon Machine, happens. This is, of course, only hypothetical.