Gate Color Theory.

[Timothy]

YAY!! My first post! Now that I got that out of the way. If there is already a theory like this on the site then delete this one I guess. Now I just thought of this theory yesterday so its not what I would call “fully polished”. Now I believe there are two threads here called The Red Lucca Gate and The Green Lavos Gate and in one of them someone says that the colors of gates are different  because of Lucca’s, Lavos’s, and the Entity’s innate elements respectively. Well that got me thinking. Lucca is not able to make a gate at all. She can make a device that is able to open gates but can’t make gates themselves. Lavos making the green gate just does not make sense to me because I see no reason for Lavos to make that particular gate. I highly doubt that Lavos would keep tabs on what every single person on the planet is doing even if a group of them were traveling through time.  Now the idea that the Entity made the all of the gates is what I believe and the common blue gate being blue because of the Entity’s  innate element being water does make sense but that does not explain the red and green gates. So how do we explain them? I’ve heard people say that those two gates are different colors because the developers wanted the player to know that those were special. Well that is the most likely reason but I believe that the color of the gate indicates how the gate works. For example: The blue gate send you through time but not space so you end up at the same place but a different time. The red gate is one level up. It is able to send you through time and space in the that dimension which explains how Lucca got from the forest to her home. Now the green gate is another level up. This lets you go through time and space but also lets you go to other dimensions which is how your able to get to Lavos’s pocket dimension with it and it has been awhile since I’ve played  Chrono Cross but I think that the gate that let you go between Home World and Another World was green also. If someone could confirm this then it will be greatly appreciated. Now I remember someone saying something about a blue gate with a ring of rainbow colored light at it’s edge. If this is true then I don’t know what to say about it but it may just be a glitch. I don’t remember the color of the gate that leads to Time Devourer but I’m pretty sure its not one the colors that I’ve mentioned before. I believe it was purple, pink, or a mix of the two and if someone could please tell me then again it will be greatly appreciated. Now for what that color means, I have no idea but it may have something to do with it going to The Darkness Beyond Time. Thanks to everyone who read this and as you can tell I’m pretty horrible at writing so please no negative feedback about my writing unless your were confused about something because of how I worded it. I can never take negative feedback well for some reason. As for the theory itself, have at it.

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Forums/index.php/topic,5028.0.html

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Forums/index.php/topic,4346.0.html

^Links to the two threads I mentioned before.

[Generality]

Please. Please, use paragraphs.

[rushingwind]

Hmmm...  This is an interesting theory, that the colors of the gate denote its use.  I've never really thought about it much, but it makes sense, and is consistent with the gates in Chrono Cross. 

It hasn't been that long since I played Chrono Cross, and yes, the dimensional gate at Opassa Beach is green (though I don't remember the color of the gate in Hydra Marshes).  I think the gate that leads to the Time Devourer is either black-ish or a dark color (my screen showed a dark grey, but it doesn't show color definition very well).

By the way...it would be much easier to read if you formatted your original post and organized it into paragraphs.  I nearly backed away from this page without reading it at all, simply because it is so difficult to read when meshed together like it is.

Other than that, a very insightful thought! 

[MagilsugaM]

Time devourer Gate IS Dark Pink and the Hydra marshes is the same colour of the Opassa Beach one.

[V_Translanka]

The red gate is one level up. It is able to send you through time and space in the that dimension which explains how Lucca got from the forest to her home.

GOOD observation! I never thought about how you start in the forest yet end up on, what I tentatively call Ashtear Island (seriously, wtf is up w/them having their own island & bridge? lol...hm, in 600AD there was no island there, which means that they probably live on a friggin VOLCANO! maybe that's where the name Ashtear originates?)...I think it's also important to note that the Red Gate is a one-shot gate. If we assume that it's for Lucca (regardless of who made it), it also only needs to move one person through time/space...perhaps these things, including the red color, all constitute a lesser degree of temporal power going into use.

Please. Please, use paragraphs.

ANOTHER good n00b observation? In the first two posts of a new thread? Amazing.

I don't know if we can call Angelus Errare a Gate, really...it's its own thing really. Very special circumstances behind it.

Is there even a gate leading to the Devourer of Time? I just remember that when you use the Time Egg there it instantly starts a battle and then you're in the DBT...Just like with Angelus Errare, I don't think that's a real Gate either...

As for the Green Go-To-Lavos, Go-Directly-To-Lavos, Do-Not-Pass-Go, Do-Not-Collect-$100 Gate...I more or less write it off as non-canon since it's New Game+ material...I don't think that stuff about it being interdimensional is true...you can use a Gate from the inside of Lavos & it's a regular Blue Gate that spits you out at the bucket...but I suppose if I wasn't just going to call it a Dream Team created Gate, I might say that it's created by the newly saved Entity to allow the team early access in order to create even more timelines in which the Entity is saved...I mean, we all know how close a shave it really was for everything after Cross, right? lol...perhaps the Green color reflects or represents the rejuvenation of power & energy to the Entity in the main timeline.

[placidchap]

I quite like this theory, tbh.  More so than my innate colour theory.

[BROJ]

The red gate is one level up. It is able to send you through time and space in the that dimension which explains how Lucca got from the forest to her home.

GOOD observation! I never thought about how you start in the forest yet end up on, what I tentatively call Ashtear Island (seriously, wtf is up w/them having their own island & bridge? lol...hm, in 600AD there was no island there, which means that they probably live on a friggin VOLCANO! maybe that's where the name Ashtear originates?)...I think it's also important to note that the Red Gate is a one-shot gate. If we assume that it's for Lucca (regardless of who made it), it also only needs to move one person through time/space...perhaps these things, including the red color, all constitute a lesser degree of temporal power going into use.

Belthasar did it.

Given if that is true, the sapling would have to be a pseudo-time egg. (Think about it. A sapling is an organism that is just beginning its life cycle; so too is an egg. And given that it was a component in opening a space-time(Red) gate, it is rather uncanny. )

Hey, I already said that! 

I don't know if we can call Angelus Errare a Gate, really...it's its own thing really. Very special circumstances behind it.

I look at as that it *isn't* a gate in the traditional "chrono" sense as it does not involve modifying the time(4-D) or space(0~3-D) coordinates. But, rather it modifies the time-error-error(6-D, fold between timelines; complicated, I'll discuss it if you desire... Edit: But, here's the short of it: The Time-Error(5-D) dimension has *2* functions in CT/CC; it is transcendent time and it serves as an index(splits a.k.a. newly created timelines); neither, of which, can be reversed(i.e. irresistible), so another dimension(6-D) is *required* to allow movement "between"(Angeles Errare) timelines of the same 0~4D coordinates) coordinate. So, "technically" it *is* a gate.

Is there even a gate leading to the Devourer of Time? I just remember that when you use the Time Egg there it instantly starts a battle and then you're in the DBT...Just like with Angelus Errare, I don't think that's a real Gate either...

Now this one is "tricky", as it leads to imaginary space(DBT); is it *really* a gate when it doesn't lead to a 'valid' coordinate?

[V_Translanka]

I just sort of meant that there's no actual Gate, nothing opens...no need for the Telepod/Gate Key...It's a completely different beast. Even the animation doesn't look alike. In CT the Gate opens, you jump in, it closes behind you and you get whisked off through the portal's trippy color-fueled vortex...in CC's Angelus Errare, the world sort of melts around Serge in blue whisps & he falls through into the other world. I mean, the Astral Amulet allows him to go between the worlds because he's the 'missing piece'...it doesn't even function like a Gate.

And I guess since you didn't mention why it was a space/time Gate, I just skimmed over when you said it, BROJ.

[BROJ]

I just sort of meant that there's no actual Gate, nothing opens...no need for the Telepod/Gate Key...

Ah... I see; I figured you meant it wasn't a gate, by definition.

I mean, the Astral Amulet allows him to go between the worlds because he's the 'missing piece'...it doesn't even function like a Gate.

Huh... I always thought that the Astral Amulet served a similar purpose as the Gate Key--to activate phenomena that changes one's position in space/time/time-error-error. It's sorta the other way around; because he's the 'missing piece' the Astral Amulet allows him to go between the worlds; the Astral Amulet is still the main component because *it activates the phenomena, not Serge.(the only seemingly violation of this is in the beginning of the game--that's because Kid(Schala--another arbiter) with her Astral Amulet activated the gate on her end and pulled Serge to the other side.) To give an example; notice how all of Serge's party members come *with* him when he warps through the dimensions. So it isn't that he is only one who can travel through the AE, because he is an Arbiter, but rather he is the only one who can activate the AE--sorta like a Gate Key activates Time Gates, but with a security protocol.(Think what would happen if that protocol wasn't there and another "Kino" got ahold of the Astral Amulet and started wreaking havoc across the dimensions--not exactly beneficial to Belthazar...)

And I guess since you didn't mention why it was a space/time Gate, I just skimmed over when you said it, BROJ.

I didn't mean to sound rude--I was being partially sarcastic; before I kinda figured that was the general consensus that the Red Gate was a space-time gate, anyways...

[Thought]

As V said, the Green Gate's status as a NewGame+ element makes it a dubious topic. However, I suppose we might take it as an indication that one is traveling to a discarded timeline (thus, actually taveling to the DBT). After all, by the time the Green Gate appears Lavos has already died so most of the events in the game are then really visits to discarded timelines (of course, this would then beg the question as to why all the other gates are still blue).

What color is that little glowing rift thingy at Opassa Beach? If my memory is correct, it is a puce green as well (maybe a puce purple?). Thus, green might indicate traveling to something that shouldn't be (discarded timelines or timelines that should be discarded).

[BROJ]

After all, by the time the Green Gate appears Lavos has already died so most of the events in the game are then really visits to discarded timelines (of course, this would then beg the question as to why all the other gates are still blue).

Pardon, but wouldn't the Green Gate be modifying one's space(from telepod to Lavos' position), time(1000A.D. to 1999A.D.), *and* accelerate Time-Error(from beginning to after Chrono and Co. defeated all of the bosses--Mother Brain, Black Tyranno, etc.-- have been defeated, in 5-D time.) as well as change one's Time-Error-Error(Timeline A--Crono leaves in green gate to Timeline B-- 'another' Crono and Co. achieved required events) position to where the 'Final Confrontation' takes place that might be the significance of the color of the Gate. Also it's a one shot Gate, just like the Red Gate. As for the blue gates they are simply 'Time Gates'.

What color is that little glowing rift thingy at Opassa Beach? If my memory is correct, it is a puce green as well (maybe a puce purple?). Thus, green might indicate traveling to something that shouldn't be (discarded timelines or timelines that should be discarded).

I like that theory, and I think it was purple...

[Thought]

Pardon, but wouldn't the Green Gate be modifying one's space(from telepod to Lavos' position), time(1000A.D. to 1999A.D.), *and* accelerate Time-Error to the point of the 'Final Confrontation'(e.g. all of the bosses--Mother Brain, Black Tyranno, etc.-- have been defeated.) that might be the significance of the color of the Gate. Also it's a one shot Gate, just like the Red Gate. As for the blue gates they are simply 'Time Gates'.

Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of "regressing Time Error." That is, Lavos has already been discarded at Time Error 1:00pm, New Game + starts at 1:01pm. Therefore all the timelines in which Lavos existed (except those prior to the Fall of Zeal on a regular time scale) would have already been shunted to the DBT. The Green Gate then takes you to a place that shouldn't exist (a space/time location where Lavos is alive, which is in the Time-Error past, at 12:59pm, as it were).

[BROJ]

Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of "regressing Time Error." That is, Lavos has already been discarded at Time Error 1:00pm, New Game + starts at 1:01pm. Therefore all the timelines in which Lavos existed (except those prior to the Fall of Zeal on a regular time scale) would have already been shunted to the DBT. The Green Gate then takes you to a place that shouldn't exist (a space/time location where Lavos is alive, which is in the Time-Error past, at 12:59pm, as it were).

--For all intents and purposes; I view time, in all forms, as change in the dimensions below.--
I updated my last post. As for regressing Time Error; it can't be done. Time Error has never been turned back. Even Belthazar couldn't do it, remember the experiment that resulted in the Time Crash.ⁱ  The reason:

The Time-Error(5-D) dimension has *2* functions in CT/CC; it is transcendent time and it serves as an index(splits a.k.a. newly created timelines); neither, of which, can be reversed(i.e. irresistible)

You *can't* undue a new timeline(It may be sent to the DBT, however, but it cannot be undone.) nor turn back 5-D time, because it is 'absolute' time (|Δ|) and since one cannot have negative change in an absolute domain--time(5-D) goes *one* way only; one may only decelerate or accelerate changes in 5-D time; so maybe it isn't *completely* "irresistible". This seems to be the case in the Chronoverse, anyways.


ⁱ[speculation]Normally everything in the Dead Sea would have been destroyed(sent to an imaginary space as Δ can never be less than 0) , but because the Frozen Flame was involved it protected itself by releasing an anti-annihilation field which instead of being annihilated sent itself far back in time with Chronopolis, swapping Chronopolis' 0~4-D coordinates(where the 4-D coordinates would reflect the attempted change in 5-D time; which is why there was temporal dampeners in case the experiment failed so that Chronopolis wasn't disintegrated across time via temporal 'inertia')  with Dinopolis'[/speculation]

[V_Translanka]

Was the one on Opassa Beach purple? Or was that the one to the whakky space of Sprigg's house?

To give an example; notice how all of Serge's party members come *with* him when he warps through the dimensions. So it isn't that he is only one who can travel through the AE, because he is an Arbiter, but rather he is the only one who can activate the AE

I dunno...there's a lot there that's hard to explain about that because of game mechanics. I mean, it doesn't really show anyone else going through at the same time as Serge because they'd have to make seperate animations for each possible team...I mean, it could be that Serge's party just holds onto him while he transfers over...who knows? It's interesting to note though that the Key Item that allows for SWITCHING party members is the Tele-Porter, which Kid gives to Serge...perhaps it's some sort of Telepod miniature of some kind? It can be used on the World Map & at Records of Fate though, which makes it all the more mysterious...

[Thought]

As for regressing Time Error; it can't be done.

Hence the quotes. As the green gate takes one to a point that should only exist in the Time Error Past, it is taking the player to a point that shouldn't exist at all. And what happens to a timeline after Time Error progresses beyond the point where it is no longer viable? It is sent to the Darkness Beyond Time (where Time Error Past "exists," in a manner of speaking). Thus I am essentially claiming that the Green Gate actually takes one to the DBT.

Side note, we never see Time or Time Error accelerated (and decelerated is just redundant), do we? People move around it, jump back at forth in it, but Time always progresses at one second per second, as does Time Error. Even Belthasar couldn't do that

V, also doesn't the Tele-porter work across the dimensions? That is, Person X is hanging out at Location Y in Another World. In home world, Serge can use the Tele-porter to switch out the team member Q for said member X. X then appears in Home World without the use of the amulet and without Serge opening/activating the hole in reality.