If you could change Chrono Cross, how would you do it?

[The Entity]

Is that sarcasm? Aren't there enough characters in Chrono Cross?

Not sarcasm. I enjoyed collecting all the characters.

[The Entity]

There's already a "If you could make Chrono Cross better, how would you do it?" thread, though, so it may interest you to check that out...

Is there? I must have missed that.

[yujinishuge]

Man oh man where do I start.

1.  Limit the game to maybe 10 or so characters.  My pick would be

Serge, Kid, Glenn, Karsh, Zoah, Leena, Norris, Radius, General Whatshisname, The mustache boat guy, and the Mermaid.  (Have not played the game in a while...)  I'd say pick a whole set of new characters related to the first game, (Schala, Glenn, Crono and Marle's son, yada yada) but then the game wouldn't be Chrono Cross  let's work with the existing set.

2.  Double techs for all and Triple Techs for all with Serge.

3.  Battles take place without switching to a new screen.  (on the world map) a la Chrono Trigger

4.  Battle system is fine, but can I please have experience and levels?

5.  Eliminate the accents!  This is stupid!

6.  Voice acting for key scenes.

7.  A less convoluted plot.   Compare:  Chrono meets a girl at the Milennial Fair and and takes her to his friend's teleportation exhibit when something goes terribly wrong.  The girl is transported into the past and Crono follows her to save her.  Crono and his friends figure out how to travel through time and discover that they must change the past to prevent a bleak future from occuring.  EASY!

Compare with:

Serge goes to a beach to collect seashells to make a necklace for his girlfriend when something goes terribly wrong!  He is transported to another dimension, similar to his own in many ways but with subtle differences.  For Serge, though the difference is major, as Serge died in this other reality.  Suddenly there's this mysterious girl with a funny accent who finds him and decides to tag along with no motivation.  They are for some reason going to search for the frozen flame, but we aren't really sure why.  Serge meets a lot of friends, including Dogs and aliens and mermaids. They go on lots of quests to do things that aren't clear as to why they are doing them.  There's nice music.  In the end you find out that the whole world in this game isn't real, it's made by a computer called fate, which controls everything, and that includes the people in the world.  This game is somehow connected to Chrono Trigger but we aren't really sure how other than that the funny girl is supposed to be Schala's clone and you have to play a song to set her free from Lavos.

Ah, this is too much.

Here's a better fix...

1.  Change the name to something that doesn't contain Chrono in it, and remove all the references to Chrono Trigger.  How about Beachwarper or something?

[The Black Wind]

1. Guile and Glenn added to the main cast.

In Chrono Cross, these two characters were optional. In the re-release, I would make them mandatory. Explain this logic to me: Glenn is one of the best characters in the game, but can only be unlocked if you opted not to save Kid with the Hydra Humour. Of course, most of us went and got it anyway because Kid was awesome, and we got Korcha instead. That's quite a price to pay for NOT being a cold, heartless bastard.

As for Guile, if he really is supposed to be an amnesiac Magus, he too should be mandatory. Guile joins you in Termina to raid Viper Manor (I would rewrite the circumstances surrounding this, as well), and at some point in the game he recovers his memory and becomes Magus once more.

2. Double/Triple-techs for everyone in the main cast.

From what I remember, the mandatory party members were Serge, Kid, and the Acacia Dragoons. There may be more. In any case, with Guile and Glenn added to the list, that would make quite a crew right there. I don't expect Square to remove all the optional characters, however I do expect them to add more depth to their crucial ones. Every pair must have three double techs apiece, as well as a triple tech with Serge. I would give the Dragoons their own triple tech as well.

3. Serge unmuted.

Why do game developers not give their main character a voice? In most cases, it's because the main character is intended to be the player, who fills in the blanks on his own. This was the case with Crono, who didn't have a past of his own and so he is intended to be the one holding the controller. Fine. But Serge? Serge's past is by far the most intriguing aspect of the game, and he has gone through so much turmoil that it is simply impossible for us to imagine ourselves in his shoes. He spoke in Radical Dreamers, and he should have spoken in Chrono Cross -- in my opinion, at least.

4. Ditch that collecting items shit (weapons/armor).

One of the most annoying things about the game was that I not only had to buy elements, but that I couldn't buy weapons and armor unless I had the necessary items. This was obviously inspired by the trip to the Prehistoric Age in Chrono Trigger, when money didn't exist and to get new weapons and armor you had to collect whatever was dropped by enemies. To me, this is fine as an option, where you can get somewhat stronger weapons and armor if you take time away from the main quest to go through the process of finding the items. However, in a game that doesn't even allow you to level up, I would at least like to be able to update my equipment without dealing with the bullshit. Oh, and while we're on the subject...

5. Let me level up my characters.

Fighting bosses will level up your elements or something, I don't really remember. But, that was fine. Experience points should be brought back for leveling up characters' stats, however. This is a straight-forward request.

6. Chrono Trigger DS extras.

Basically, the same extras that were in CTDS, but for CC. Again, pretty straight-forward request.



That's all for now.

[Shadow D. Darkman]

Is there a difference in how things play out if you DON'T decide to save Kid?

[Dark Serge]

There's a pretty huge difference yeah. A few out of the top of my head:

- You'll never get Razzly, so there will be no Hydra baby, the dwarfs will not return to the forest, and Rosetta will die. You will get the Serge and Kid campfire scene after the Ice Breath quest though.

- You won't have Kid during the S.S. Invincible chapter

- You won't get Korcha and he will be upset with you for the rest of the game finding you a scam who doesn't help his friends

- Norris will bring the Hydra Humour to Kid

- You get Glenn (which is a pretty big difference in itself but you'll have to see yourself when you take him to Fort Dragonia)

[LavosFan]

Youll also get Korcha's mom, whatever her name is.

@Black Wind= The whole collecting items for equipment thing isnt really a Chrono series unique feature, you can find it in other square games. They just want you to work for the good equipment, instead of easily buying it, but I guess it can get annoying. Maybe they should make it so that only the final equipment needs you to gather items, that would make it better, perhaps.

I also don't mind the no level ups. I played FFIV recently, and whenever I told someone that I was having trouble with a specific boss, their advice would always be "youre probably underleveled". It seems that whenever someone gets stuck, instead of trying to come up with some sort strategy and make the game fun, they just overlevel and brute force their way through the tough parts of games, but thats me.

If I had to change something, I would agree with Black Wind and give Serge lines, and give double and triple techs around, those are some nice stuff that I had never really thought about but it would definitely make the game more enjoyable, at least for me.

[The Entity]

Youll also get Korcha's mom, whatever her name is.

Macha.

And on a related note, I just re-bought CC yesterday. I can't wait for it to arrive.

[Umaro]

1. Guile and Glenn added to the main cast.

I think the exact reason they are optional is because they're so great; they wanted to make them harder to get.

Making Guile mandatory because he's Magus(not saying he definitely is, but if it turns out that way) would do exactly what they tried to avoid. If Magus was in the game, everyone would probably use him Serge, and Kid, exclusively. They put so many characters in the game for variety. Making Guile mandatory would negate that.

2. Double/Triple-techs for everyone in the main cast.

Yeah, I can get behind this.

3. Serge unmuted.

First, Radical Dreamers Serge is not Chrono Cross Serge.

Second, I love silent protagonists because I can mentally insert whatever thoughts and dialougue I want into a situation, but that's me.

4. Ditch that collecting items shit (weapons/armor).

I admit, it was irritating at times, but, ultimately, I liked it because it's one of the things that made Chrono Cross more unique.

5. Let me level up my characters.

I believe stats do increase depending on how much you use certain actions. Attack more, strength goes up. Use elements more, magic goes up(like in Final Fantasy II only better). I get what you're saying, though; you want straight up experience. I'm not a grinder. So I much prefer Chrono Cross's leveling system.

6. Chrono Trigger DS extras.

Sounds good to me.

[The Black Wind]

I think the exact reason they are optional is because they're so great; they wanted to make them harder to get.

Making Guile mandatory because he's Magus(not saying he definitely is, but if it turns out that way) would do exactly what they tried to avoid. If Magus was in the game, everyone would probably use him Serge, and Kid, exclusively. They put so many characters in the game for variety. Making Guile mandatory would negate that.

That would be pretty stupid, considering the possibility that someone could play through the entire game and never encounter two of its best characters. If you're going to put forth the effort into making two great characters, they should be accessible to everyone. And Guile himself wasn't really a great character, though he could have been if they went the Magil route. If Magus is indeed Guile, I expect it to be a mandatory and elaborate plot element in the re-release, as Magus is just as much of a central character in the series as Schala, Lavos, etc.

And despite putting so many characters in the game for variety, they really didn't have that many. They were different characters in name and appearance only. It basically came down to equipping the elements you wanted on the characters that you wanted to have them. Your strategies more or less remained the same. This is what I'm trying to fix. With the addition of more double/triple techs, you're not going to want the same party all the time.

First, Radical Dreamers Serge is not Chrono Cross Serge.

Second, I love silent protagonists because I can mentally insert whatever thoughts and dialougue I want into a situation, but that's me.

Yes, I'm aware of this. But the Serge of Radical Dreamers and the Serge of Chrono Cross were main protagonists -- so why is only one of them able to speak?

I understand your second point, and like I said, this was perfectly fine for Crono. He's a normal guy just like you or me, who is thrown into the game without a backstory because whatever happened to him prior to the fair is irrelevant to the plot.

Serge, however, is a completely different story. It's impossible to relate to him and fill in the gaps accurately because his past is such a major plot point and is so unlike our own (at least, I would hope so). For example, Serge has a fear of cats because of what happened to him when he was young. Most of us don't, and because he doesn't speak the only way we even know that he has a fear of cats is when another character explains it to him. Considering that Serge is the one who's gone through so much shit in his life, I want to know what HE is really thinking/feeling during the game. Like when he first encounters Lynx, or when they switch bodies, or when he finds out that Lynx was his father. I really think that giving Serge his own dialogue would add far more to the game than it would take away.

[Delta Dragon]

1.  Change the name to something that doesn't contain Chrono in it, and remove all the references to Chrono Trigger.  How about Beachwarper or something?

First of all, that sounds stupid.  Second, if you look deeper into the plot than what you just described it's amazing just how much the two games connect.  So if it were to not be Chrono there would be some very major changes.

[Shadow D. Darkman]

I really think that giving Serge his own dialogue would add far more to the game than it would take away.

I agree. Cross is just one of those games where you just have to have EVERYONE speaking, even Serge, the "Silent Protagonist."

[yujinishuge]

1.  Change the name to something that doesn't contain Chrono in it, and remove all the references to Chrono Trigger.  How about Beachwarper or something?

First of all, that sounds stupid.  Second, if you look deeper into the plot than what you just described it's amazing just how much the two games connect.  So if it were to not be Chrono there would be some very major changes.

Sure sure, there are references to the first game all over it. I remember, I played the game, but they all seemed contrived.

It wouldn't be anything major at all except changing some text, removing the kids from the game, and change Schala to Serge from the other world...


I don't mean that they should actually do this, but it would have been very easily not a game related to chrono trigger.


But then again, the Final Fantasies aren't related either, but nobody complains..

[Umaro]

If Magus is indeed Guile, I expect it to be a mandatory and elaborate plot element in the re-release, as Magus is just as much of a central character in the series as Schala, Lavos, etc.

Well, I see your point about getting their feet wet and now having to jump in. The ending in CTDS implied something was going on with Magus, and now they should follow through.

It just seems to me that if they made Guile, no doubt about it definitely Magus, his presence would downplay all the other characters in the game. Granted, many weren't too exciting to begin with, but having Magus in the game would make the others throwaways.

I really think that giving Serge his own dialogue would add far more to the game than it would take away.

You make an interesting case. Serge is more complex than Crono, and Serge probably would make for some fascinating conversation. The only thing that irks me is that if he was given a concrete personality, I would feel cheated in the instances in which you choose his dialogue. I'd feel obligated to answer in the way I'd think Serge would answer instead of how I would. I guess that's my problem though.

[Shadow D. Darkman]

Perhaps how he responds can be based on which choice you make, like in Mass Effect.