Chrono Trigger DS Analysis HQ (Spoiler Spoiler, of course)

[maggiekarp]

Edit: Wait, their death isn't totally official I've actually heard a great new theory that Dalton simply kept them busy long enough for Porre troops to basically burn Guardia Castle and Truce to the ground. Then perhaps he ran away snickering.

MAGGIEKARP SHOULD DRAW THIS

I didn't follow these posts 100%, but I think it gets the point across.

[Prince Janus]

wait...  Guardia castle's made of stone. does fire kill stone?

[Eket]

I'm just thinking here, basically Dalton will cause the fall and obviously Crono, Marle and Lucca are not around to help in the fight.

Apparently you fight a clone of Crono, Marle and Lucca in each of the dimensional vortexes, or did i read that wrong? What if them fighting their clones, and the dream devourer are the events that tie them up, giving Dalton free reign over Guardia. They just weren't there.

Schala eventually sends them back to the point where the fall of guardia is already taking place or has already taken place.

I'm probably wrong though...

[Dark Serge]

Yeah that was my theory too at first. What if Schala messed up and sent em' back to where it was already too late? Even still, they could use the Epoch to go back to 1000 AD before it happened anyway.

About the creation of the Temporal Vortexes; god knows how. After I defeated Lavos for the first time, the ending just rolled through, and after that I got a message saying "Ending 01 blabla added to Ending log, Temporal Vortex is now open."

I guess they were created as a result of defeating Lavos or something. Or maybe it was there all along, but we could only access it after defeating Lavos.

On a side note, those Dalton comics are comedy gold

[Chrono'99]

Didn't got that new ending yet (though I saw the YouTube clips), but here are a few possible theories:

Magus and Guile
Anyone knows if the sequence is the same if you didn't recruit Magus?

The "Future" Magus says he doesn't know if Crono's party is from the same dimension as his. If he shows up and says the same thing in that sequence if you killed Magus earlier at North Cape, I think this would suggest that "Future" Magus is from a different dimension rather than the main one. Perhaps what Masato Kato wanted to show is that Guile is an incarnation of Magus, but not the Magus from your party.

Compare this with the ending of Chrono Cross, in which Kato implied that YOU (the player) is essentially an incarnation of Serge in the real world and that you have your own version of Schala Kid searching for you somewhere out there. (See last question in this interview.)


How can Crono's party even meet the Dream Devourer?
They can because this only happens in New Game+, i.e. in the timeline in which the Time's Eclipse/Darkness Beyond Time already saw a defeated Lavos enter it. Crono's party can still meet the living Lavos in 1,999 A.D., but that's because his pocket dimension may not be extra-temporal after all.

To understand that, imagine that Serge, in Chrono Cross, could time travel to 12,001 B.C. (one year before the Ocean Palace incident). He would definitely meet Schala in Zeal, but that doesn't change the fact that in the Darkness Beyond Time, a Schala has already appeared from 12,000 B.C. to form the Time Devourer.

To go back to CT DS...This basically means that in New Game+, you're playing the "past" versions of the time travelers (the "present" versions are the ones from New Game, who defeated Lavos and created the Dream Devourer for the "past" versions to see). Mmh, actually, this should mean that the "past" versions get Time Bastarded at one point...I'm not sure this theory holds water, but it's something to consider. Especially if their Time Bastardization is what leads to the party not remembering Dalton's shocking relevation.

[mav]

Wait, the new ending doesn't happen in New Game+ though, if I'm not mistaken: it happens after you've defeated Lavos and all those clones.

The "Future" Magus says he doesn't know if Crono's party is from the same dimension as his. If he shows up and says the same thing in that sequence if you killed Magus earlier at North Cape, I think this would suggest that "Future" Magus is from a different dimension rather than the main one. Perhaps what Masato Kato wanted to show is that Guile is an incarnation of Magus, but not the Magus from your party.

Brilliant point, this needs to be examined forthwith. Personally, I think this is Magus from a completely different timeline, but I haven't played through, so fuck if I know.

As for Dalton and his meddling, it's completely possible that he's already set the gears in motion by the time Crono and co. confront him in 1000ad, and with a long enough distraction, the fall of Guardia is eminent. OR if Schala also wiped the memories of Crono and co, then they may have simply forgot that Dalton was bringing up the Porre army and by the time they figured it out, they were overwhelmed by the force they were dealing with.

[Acacia Sgt]

Hey, that can work, they can be past versions of them that got sidetracked by these new places.

After all, even if they are in, for example, 600 A.D. fighting Retinite, before, while going for the Masamune, there wasn't any Sunken Desert, but after telling the woman in Zeal not to burn the seed, there now is, meaning all past versions who crossed 600 A.D. for various reasons (Looking for the Masamune, going to Magus's Castle, etc.), are now going to see the place. Eventually, they will get Time Bastarded, but still, they can do something that can make a further change to the time line to the ones already done (thankfully they don't, or else more troubles could arrise to keep track of the continuity).

So, it can work, while preparing to fight Lavos, they stumble across these new places, opened by their future versions who defeated Lavos, decided to check them out, but in the end, it's meaningless since they got Time Bastarded after.

[Agent 12]

I really think that the prophet outfit is a hint that we are being shown the timeline that happens if Crono and company didn't get the epoch after being kicked out of zeal by schala and the prophet.

My theory is that the ocean palace events happened the prophet got his ass kicked by lavos again schala got sucked up but the prophet kept fighting eventually getting to the new ending stuff we see in CT:DS.  It explains his new persona cause we don't know how long it's been.


--JP

[Prince Janus]

 Can someone explain why they have to be sent to when Guardia is destroyed? That doesn't happen for another five years.


   ...I think this community is going to become the reincarnation of the Zelda community after this game gets released. >_>     (yes, the real one is dead.)

[Acacia Sgt]

My theory is that the ocean palace events happened the prophet got his ass kicked by lavos again schala got sucked up but the prophet kept fighting eventually getting to the new ending stuff we see in CT:DS.  It explains his new persona cause we don't know how long it's been.

It can't be, Magus mentions 'we' as in he was with the party when Lavos was defeated.

[Dark Serge]

Can someone explain why they have to be sent to when Guardia is destroyed? That doesn't happen for another five years.

Because Schala maybe messed up. She was already fusing with Lavos and part of her already wanted to send the world into oblivion. She teleported everyone outta there, but it wouldn't be strange if she sent them slightly off from the time she wanted to sent them to.

Also, jsondag2, that's impossible, because after the Ocean Palace Incident Schala was sent to the DBT, but Lavos wasn't there yet, because he wasn't defeated yet. Therefore, it's impossible for them to fuse at that point.

[Agent 12]

Acacia:

we could be him and any other zealian that helped him in his battle.  

Serge:

Prophet over time defeats lavos himself (i guess with some other party to account for the 'we').  Then lavos goes to the DBT and fuses.

--JP

EDIT:  I really dont think kato just randomly decided to use the prophet sprite.  He knew we would be asking the which magus this is and I think using that sprite is a HUGE hint. 

[Acacia Sgt]

we could be him and any other zealian that helped him in his battle.  

But if he wonders if it is the future of Crono and company then that 'we' refers to them.

[Agent 12]

"here lavos is no more.  This is the future where we've defeated him"

I think that can go anyway.  I agree that 99% of the time the we in that sentence would be for the person present but I think that it can be taken in another context. 

Um.....lets say the united states blew up the moon.  and a convoy from russia came to the moon but instead saw george bush sitting there in a pod.  Bush could say, no the moon is not here in this future we've destroyed the moon.  The we wouldn't be the convoy from russia it would be the united states.

In this case the moon is a giant porcupine, russia is crono and company and we is the prophet and some zealians he recruited.

--JP

[Prince Janus]

 No...  what I mean is, why not just go back to 1000 AD and wait five years for Dalton to show up?