Author Topic: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)  (Read 19472 times)

utunnels

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2008, 11:22:55 pm »
Coil its tongue up?

Literaly...
It means 'very surprised'(marveled or something like that)

utunnels

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #16 on: December 10, 2008, 04:12:11 pm »
Quote
嵐の海の一瞬をそのまま結晶化させた
様な逸品であるが、美しさよりはむしろ
その生々しさ、凄惨さがきわだっていた。

It looks just like the storming sea frozen(solidified) in time, very exquisitely crafted .
It is more realistic and dreary/tragic than beautiful.

I'm just reading this section, the treasure room in scenario 'Home Coming: Shea's Light'.
It reminds me of the Dead Sea.

---------------

I don't know how to say about this section.
Remeber the corpse in the 'dead sea'? Right, there's only one corpse, not a group of them.
It is the control center of the trap(Siren and the sea).
At last, Serge smashes its head, or he figures it out and let Magil blow it up(based on what choice you make), everything returns to normal(the storming sea is solidified again, and the Siren stops moving).
 

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utunnels

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2008, 01:47:48 am »
Cool. Thanks for putting those scattered things in order.

art_garfunkel

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Re: Another side of Magil in Radical Dreamers(spoilers)
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2008, 02:32:32 am »
The Schala personality is much more evident in the original. This is fascinating. Do you mind if it's moved to Other Topics and the Prerelease? I guess the analysis forums can be a graveyard, but that'll definitely ensure it gets analyzed in the next Review.

Indeed, this is quite radical. Perhaps we should work on a retranslation from the original as well.
I would be extremely interested in reading/playing that. Of course, I think a Chrono Cross Retranslation Project would be time better spent, but, since I can neither translate or insert translated text into a game, I guess I shouldn't complain.

utunnels

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2008, 05:49:02 am »
Well, battle descriptions contains most differences, but since those have less to do with the story line itself, maybe we can ignore them, if they cause the same result...
Still, discuss them just for fun.

One of them is in the battle with Lynx:

Translated:
Quote
With as much power as she can muster, Kid kicks at Lynx, sweeping him off his feet!
"Hah!"
 Spitting blood, Kid coughs a little, but still, a smile manages to come through her agony.

Original
Quote
力の限りにキッドを蹴りつけるヤマネコ!
Lynx kicks Kid with all his strength!
「ぐあ……!!」
"Ahh....!!"
 血を吐いて、転がるキッド!
Kid rolls on the ground, spitting bood.

It seems that's just a simple mistranslation. That sentence is 'Kid who's kicked by Lynx with all his strength...' literally, an upside-down expression might cause confusion. Or the translator has his own wish to punish Lynx a bit more.

----------------------

The demon summons a crowd of rats:

Quote
From behind me, I start to hear noises. A few moments later, I see some sort of creatures scurrying along the ground, running towards us in masses.
 They're giant rats!!

Quote
ふいに通路の奥がざわめきはじめた。
There's some noises in the far end of the corridor.
何かが駆けて来る。
Something is coming.
 不快な動物の臭いが鼻を刺激する。
I can smell an aweful stink from animals.
 どぶネズミ、クマネズミ、ハツカネズミ
ハムスター、モルモット、リス……
Rats, roof rats, house mice, hamsters, Guinea pigs, squirrels...
「げっ歯類の大群……??」
"A large crowd of rodents...??"

----------------------------------------
Below is about Magil's combat skill
----------------------------------------


I'm think about how to give 'kakuya' a proper translation.

Translated
Quote
Magil, faced with two goblins of his own, has already managed to reduce one to a bloody mess on the floor. The remaining beast looks as though it's already received its share of dents and bruises as well.
 Even with no physical weapons of any kind, Magil looks as though he's having no trouble pulverizing the enemy with hand-to-hand tactics.

Original
Quote
 先ほどまで2匹を相手にしていたが、
すでに一匹は床に倒れ、残る奴と対峙して
いた。
Magil who fought 2 foes, now has already beaten one of them to the ground, and is now facing to another.
 ゴブリンの身に付けている鉄の鎧に、数
多くのへこみが見られる。
And that goblin's iron armor already has several dents on it
 ギルは、武器を持たない。かぐや流の格
闘術を持って敵を粉砕する。故に、倒され
た相手は全身紫色だ。キッドは、真っ赤
にするけど……。
Magil fights without weapons. His ''Kakuya Martial art" can crush foes in the way.
So, that fallen goblin is purple all over, while the one beaten by Kid is red(bloody stained)...

-----------------------------------------------


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SELENE
This page is about the second Japanese lunar orbiter spacecraft SELENE(aka, kaguya/かぐや).
Also, you can check the Japanese wiki: http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%81%8B%E3%81%90%E3%82%84

Quote
The orbiter's nickname, Kaguya, which was selected by the general public, derives from the name of a lunar princess in the ancient Japanese folktale The Tale of the Bamboo Cutter. After the successful release of its sub-satellites Rstar and Vstar, they were named Okina and Ouna, also from folklore.

BTW:
That lunar princess from 竹取物語/Tale of the Bamboo Cutter is called 'かぐや姫'(princess kaguya), which is '煇夜姫' when written in kanji. 煇 means light, 夜 means night.

I search in wiki again: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tale_of_the_Bamboo_Cutter
Quote
Kaguya-hime (かぐや姫 "radiant-night princess").

-------------------


Back to RD, it's used in another place, as a skill name of Magil: かぐや魔殺光輪蹴り, which is translated as Lunachant Ringforce Kick(a cool translation IMO). Maybe the literal meaning is Luna(かぐや) Demon Slaying(魔殺) Gloriole(光輪) Kick(蹴), a way too long.

I found the page in the compendium http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Magic_(Radical_Dreamers).html

Yeah, the incantation translation is good.

---------------------------------

Another detail about Magil's combat skill:

In the translated version, Magil use a light bolt in a certain skeleton battle.
Quote
All of a sudden, Magil sends a bolt of light streaking out, precisely above my head where the skull is!
It instantly explodes, sending fragments of the skull into my hands and head!
"Aaaahhh!"


In fact, it is a heel kick(axe kick).
Quote
バキッ!!
paaa!!
 ギルのかかと落としが、ボクの脳天に
炸裂した。
Magil's axe kick explodes above my head.
「ガハッ!」
"Ahh!"
The skeleton's skull shatters of course, but the description is in next paragraph, I didn't write it down.

« Last Edit: December 12, 2008, 06:58:19 am by utunnels »

Romana

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #21 on: December 13, 2008, 09:38:39 pm »
This is really interesting... Huge changes! Thanks a ton, utunnels!

It might be kind of interesting if the 'future' Magus in CTDS turned out to be based off of the mean, cold Magil in The Shadow Realm and the Goddess of Death...
...stupid as that sounds.

utunnels

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #22 on: December 14, 2008, 12:06:05 am »
Yeah, probably.
But I have a feeling that besides the main story line, other scenarios are just Serge's "dream". Although it is not pointed out in game(yeah, Kato won't make it clear even if he did has the idea, I guess 一_一), but those scenarios all begain with a scene that Serge feels sleepy.


« Last Edit: December 14, 2008, 12:08:49 am by utunnels »

utunnels

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #23 on: December 15, 2008, 02:15:29 pm »
Hmm, I noticed this when i check the map on gamefaps, a certain branch is flipped left-right.


<Label 0x00A4AA>
 After a while, the path splits into three directions. To the left is a descending staircase, while the path on the right extends into darkness. Another passageway lies ahead...



<Label 0x00A4AA>
 テラスから左側へのびる通路を進んで
ゆくと、階段と別れ道にぶつかった。
We goes along the lefter path extends from the terrace, soon, we see a branch.
 右には下に降りる階段、左には暗い
脇道、そして通路は、まだ先にと延びて
いる……。
To the right is a descending stairway, to the left is a dark passage. Ahead of use, the passage extends continually...




About the goblins.


Yeah, goblins all have a pet phrase.
At first I thought they were calling each other...
I don't know whether it is worthy to metion, because Kid uses 'mate' quite often in the translated version like in CC which does not exist in the original script.

Goblins like to add a 'gobu', or 'bubu', or 'gobubu' or 'gobulu' ... at the end of their lines.

For example, the goblin captain in the sunflower scenario:


Quote
「そうか……ゴブ。
 おめえの親友が捕まってんのかゴブ……
 わかったゴブ、必ず助けだしてやるゴブ!
 安心しろゴブ!」
"I see...gobu.
So your good friend got caught gobu...
I understand gobu, I'll help you gobu!
Don't worry gobu!"



Scenario 'Home Coming: Shea's Light'.
Well, I like to call her Shae instead of Shea...

"I've waited a century for this moment, to put an end to Lynx," Magil says...
I got comfused here, well, if so, Magil(or Lynx) is really old or he must mean another thing...
Yeah, in fact, he's telling Shae to wait for another 100 years...(remind me of Dracula, lol)


Quote
Mortified, Kid is unable to say a word.
"Thank you for hearing me. The truth is known, finally. Now please, save yourself, my precious... little... Kid..."
 Kids takes a deep breath, staring at the shiny jewel she's been seeking for so long.
"I choose... I choose to end it," she says solemnly.
"Place it on the ground before you," says Magil. Kid does so, and not long after, Magil's thick voice begins to echo out an incantation.
 Looking over at him, an arc of magic streaks out from his fingertips towards the Flame! The scarlet jewel takes on a strange, dark color, as it begins to hum louder and louder...
 Shea smiles upon seeing this.
"Thank you... thank you for setting me free...
"I've waited a century for this moment, to put an end to Lynx," Magil says, smiling broadly. "And now... it is finished."
 As the Flame continues to glow darker and darker with its new hollow, grey aura, Magil shouts "Serge, take cover, and hold Kid to you! The Flame is losing stability!!"
 .....................
 ..................
 ............
 ......
 ...



I can't remember what happened next very clearly...

 The magic seal's radiance...
 Lynx's contorted screams...
 Magil invoking his magic...
 ...Shea's comforting smile.




 And...





 ...a tear rolling down Kid's cheek.
 When I come to, I find that I'm lying on the ground, holding Kid tightly to me, rubbing the soot out of my eyes. How long have I been laying here?
 Our clothes have been tattered, and our bodies have sustained more than their fair share of bruises. But... we're all right.
 It looks like Magil was thrown over to the opposite side of the room. He lays there silently, exhausted of all energy, fast asleep.




Quote
「シェア!
 ヤマネコのヤローは、まだ確かにハラ
 ペコなんだな?」
"Shae,!
Why not stop Lynx's terror once for all?"
突然、静寂を破り、ギルの胴間声が響く!
Suddenly, Magil's loud voice breaks the silence.
 見ると、今まで一心不乱に魔法陣に何
かを書き加えていた……らしい。
He was concentrating on drawing new symbols to the magic field just now.
 それを聞いたシェアの顔が一瞬怪訝そ
うに傾き……
Hearing that, a surprised expression appears on Shae 's face...
 そして、にっこりと、とても晴れ晴れ
とした笑みを浮かべた。
Then, she gives a cheerful smile.
「有り難う、ギル。
 あなたには、結局、世話になり放しで
 すね……」
"Thank you Magil, for freeing me from all of those..."
 ギルは今まで見せたことのない見事な
笑みで応える。
This is the first time I see Magil smiles.
「あと百年くらい、待ちな。
 あっちで『生き返るほど』取り立てて
 やる!
 ……と、セルジュ!」
"Wait for another hundred years.
Wait there for 'resurection'!
....and, Serge!"
 部外者のような気になっていたボクは
突然名を呼ばれて飛び上がった。
I'm in deep thought when he calls my name.
「今から、『反魂の呪』を強制的に立ち
 上げる!
 ヤマネコの魂を、まだ準備の出来てな
 いぼろぼろの身体に、強制的に還す!
 ……だから、……」
"Now, I will compel to execute the 'anti-soul spell'!
Lynx's soul will be forced back into his unprepared, broken body!
...so.... "
「ギルっ!てめぇ!
 そんなことをしたらシェアまで……!」
"Magil! You bastard!
If so, even Shae's soul will....!"
 キッドがはっと正気づく。
Kid shouts angrily.
「だから、セルジュ!
 邪魔しないようにキッドをしっかり押
 さえとけ!」
"So, Serge!
You MUST prevent Kid to intervene at all costs!"
……………………………………………
 ………………………………
 ………………
 …………
 ……
 その後のことを、ボクは良く憶えて
いない。
I don't remember what happened exactly.
 魔法陣のきらめき。
The shining magic field.
 ひしゃげるようなヤマネコの叫び声。
Lynx's twisted screaming.
 印を結ぶギルの黒い巨躯。
Magil's tall black figure who is drawing the magic seal.
 シェアの微笑み。
Shae's smile.



 そして、
and


 …………キッドの涙。
.......Kid's tears.
 気が付くと、ボクは目を真っ赤に泣き
はらしたキッドを抱えぐったりしていた。
Later, I hug Kid who's eyes are red after weeping, completely tired out.
 服のあちこちに裂け目が、身体のあち
こちに切り傷が、ボクにもキッドにもた
くさんあった。
We are both wounded and tattered.
 ギルは向こうの床で、精根尽き果てた
のかぐっすりと眠り込んでいる。
Magil lies on the far end of the floor, sleeping, he must have used the last of his strength.




The scene about Lynx's death.
I don't know how to translate '精気', I use vigor anyway, it is something different with soul. Maybe we can call it spirit, but that  usually has similar meaning with soul...

Demiforce version. It's more detailed, but it doesn't explain the strangeness of the corpse well IMO.
Quote
As expected, these are Lynx's quarters.
 Or should I say, `were'...
 Staring at the sight before our eyes, all I can do is gasp in silence, half surprised, half terrified.
 To put it simply, Lynx is quite certainly in this room.
 ...However, not as we expected.
 Lynx's corpse has been hastily stashed in the couch on the far end of the room. Only his mangled hand is visible, sticking out from beneath a cushion.
 Kid goes over and slowly lifts up one of the cushions.
 I don't know if it's the smell or the sight that makes her gag. But yes, it's definitely Lynx under there.
 I never expected any of this when I came here tonight. I mean, rumors of Lord Lynx's reign have been going around as strong as ever. Although when I think about it, his reputation alone could probably carry on such a regime. I wonder how long it's been since this happened...
"It can't be. That genocidal, terror-driven maniac... he burnt the temple and abducted Shea... how can he be dead already? I wanted my revenge...!" Kid mutters, tears swelling in her eyes.
 Shea... hmm... where have I heard that name before...
"No one knows Lynx is dead except for us... We must be the first ones to find out about it."
"...Heh, or maybe not," Kid adds.
 Her attempt at humor only succeeds in causing my feeling of dread to grow even stronger...
 ..................
 ............
 ......
 ...
"Strange..."
 Magil kneels down and lifts off the cushions, examining the corpse as though he was a coroner.
"Hey, I always liked a nice firm seat," Kid says, pretending to sit down on it.
 Enough with the bad jokes already, Kid...
"This corpse has no life-essence," Magil continues.
"Isn't that how corpses usually are?" I ask.
"Generally, yes. When a person dies, one's consciousness, or spirit, is separated from the body. Normally, as the spirit leaves the body, the corpse will crumble over time. However, in this case, this corpse is aged, but it has not even started to crumble at all yet. It is merely without moisture."
"Lynx's spirit has not yet been released."
"So that means..."
"Yes, his spirit is still here, probably somewhere within this mansion."
 Magil seems unusually disturbed by all this. First the phantom, then that whole siren thing, now this... even he's having trouble keeping his cool.
 We're in over our heads.
"Lynx was apparently slain by a blade," Magil says, pointing to a gash in his belly.
 Looking around, he finds the murder weapon. It's a bloody sword, stashed behind a chair. "An Acacian sword... interesting."
 Magil tries to remain focused, racking his brain for information.
"If a body and its spirit have been detached in this manner, the body will yearn for its spirit. It will transform into a sort of bottomless well, endlessly seeking spirits until it finds its own."
"What does that have to do with us? ...Oh," Kid says solemnly.

 Something's happening...
 This room, no, the whole house... all around us, the walls are starting to creak...
 There's something in here, waiting for us. I can feel it on the back of my neck.
 I whip around with my knife ready, but nothing's there.
 Suddenly, something grabs my arm! Oh no, get it off me! I whip around again, but it's only Kid!
"Get a grip, mate! It's just me!"
 Phew...
"We've got the Flame. Lynx is dead. Why do we even need to be here anymore!? Come on, let's go!" she shouts. She's right, screw this place!
"If we can get out of here at all," Magil adds, standing up.
 And then, the walls begin to creak again. We look around...
 The lights flicker. Don't go out... Please, God, don't go out...
"...Kid..."
 We instantly whip around. The voice is coming from the mirror!
"Finally... you have come."
 ...That girl... the one from before... It's her! She's here, faintly floating within the mirror!


Original script
Quote
 果たして、そこはヤマネコ大君の部屋
だった。
 この場合の『だった』は真の意味での
過去形であり……
 何を言ってるんだボクは……
 つまり、えと、いかん、気が動転して
言葉が形を成さない……
 つまり、ヤマネコ大君は、確かにこの
部屋にいるのだ。
 ……ただし、死体の状態で。
 どこかの騎士と相打ちになった様子で。
「……ば、バカな…奴が死んでたなんて
 噂にすら聞いたこと無い……」
 …キッドの言うとおりだ。
 ヤマネコ程の人間のなら普通、何につ
けても噂のタネにされるものだ。
 まして、本人の生死に関することなら、
いやでもボクらの耳に入ってきてる筈……
 逆にこうして死体が捨て置かれている
のに、そんな噂が全く聞かれないなんて、
考えられない……
「うそだろ、おい、ヤマネコ……
 領民大虐殺の極悪人が……
 シェアを奪った張本人が……
 とっくに死んでたなんて、
 反則だぜ…」
 キッドが呆然として、呟いている。
「今まで誰も、この死体を見つけられな
 かったなんて事は…無い……よね」
「……見つけた奴が、誰一人戻らなかっ
 ただけかもな」
 キッドが重苦しい雰囲気を振り払うつ
もりで言ったらしいこの軽口は、完全に
逆効果だった。
 しゃ、シャレになってない……
 ボクらは、何となくおし黙ってしまう。
 ……………………………………
 ………………………………
 ………………………
 …………
「おかしい」
 化学者的な冷たい熱意でヤマネコの死
体を観察していたギルが、静寂を破る。
「確かに笑える死にざまだよな、うん」
 キッドが、わだかまる瘴気を振り払う
ようにワザと軽く受け流す。
 しかし、いつもの事ながら、ギルはそ
のまま無機質な調子で続けた。
「この死体には、精気がない」
「死んでるんだから、当たり前だろ?」
 ボクは、ギルがいったい何を言いたい
のか分からなかった。
「普通、死ぬと意識と意志――魂――が
 身体から離れる。
 しかし、精気は身体の一部だ。
 普通、身体に残って、死体が崩れるに
 従ってゆるゆると拡散する」
「でもよ、ずいぶんと古い死体だぜ。
 全部、散っちまったんじゃないの?」
 キッドは、もう、早くこの部屋から出
て行きたげだ。
「この死体には、
 精気のカケラすら残っていない。
 いや、
 かつて精気が満ちていた痕跡すら、見
 あたらない。
 ここまで徹底的に精気が抜けるには…」
 …ギルは珍しく困惑しているらしい。
「ヤマネコと相打ちになってるこの騎士
 がバンパイヤだったとか……」
 ボクは乏しい魔導系の知識をふり絞っ
てみる。
 幽霊少女に機械の人魚。無人の館に主
の死体が転がる、か……
 ボクもキッドと同じく、もうここから
出ていきたかった。
 しかし、ギルはそんなボクらに気付か
ないのか、気付いて自分の興味を優先し
ているのか……
「いや、バンパイヤなら精気は根こそぎ
 だが、魂は身体から離れない。
 そして、死んで底抜けになった身体に
 精気を注ぎ込もうとして、自分も夜な
 夜な犠牲者を求めるようになる……」
「じれったいな~
 この死体は、魂も精気もすっからかん
 だと。
 で、だからどうだってわけ?
 何か困ること、あるの?」
 キッドがじれて、ギルを睨む。
 キッドの感じているものが、ボクにも
何となく分かった。
 何か、変だ。
 この部屋、いや、館全体が。
 がらんとして、人の生活している様子
などまるでないのに、しかし、今思うと
館全体に強力な意志を感じる。
 ただの、幽霊屋敷では、無い…らしい
「凍てついた炎は手に入れた。
 ヤマネコの野郎も死んでた。
 もう、こんなところにいる理由なんて、
 毛の先程もない!
 とっとと出ようぜ」
 キッドが再三叫ぶ。
「……出られたらな……」
 キッドに陰気に応えたギルの相貌は、
奥の壁に作りつけの大きな鏡に向けられ
ていた。
「…キッド……
 来て…
 とうとう……来てしまったのね……」
 …………!
 ……あの娘、だ……
 古風な僧服に身を包んだ……
 とても悲しげな……
「彼女は、どうやら俺らに行って欲しく
 ないらしいな……」

My translation.
Quote
As I expected, this is Lynx's room.
Or, may I say 'used to be'......
Why......
Anyway, no words can express how surprised I am now...
First of all, Lynx is in this room.
....But, he's dead.
It seems there was a fight occured here.
"Ah....fool....why didn't you notify us before you died...."
...Saids Kid.
Lynx is not a nobody, there are rumours about him even in ordinary days, let alone his death, such an important event...
But, there's not any information about it at all.
But, then I realize, the corpse is still here, that means nobody has discovered it, so there can't be any rumours about it...
"Impossible, sigh, Lynx...you genocidal murderer..the one who abducted Shae...how could you die that early, you cheater..."
Kid mutters, stands there dazed.
"Perhaps by now...nobody has discovered this...corpse..."
"....Or, the one who found it did not manage to leave here alive."
Maybe Kid wants to make a joke about it to remove the depressing atmosphere, but only results an exactly opposite effect.
Coult it be, Shae...
We all become silent suddenly.
....................................................
..................................
..................
..........
"Interesting."
Magil, who was examining the corpse with great interests and ardor like a Chemist, breaks the silence suddenly.
"The corpse looks really funny, hmm."
Kid says, while stepping aside like she's avoiding the miasma.
But , as usual, Magil continues with his scholar like tone.
"This corpse, has no vigor."
"As a corpse, what do you expect it to have?"
I don't know what Magil wants to say.
"Usually, one's mind and thought--the soul--will leave the body after the owner dies. But vigor is part of the body too, they will evaporate bit by bit as the corpse is rotting away."
"So, that means he's dead for a long time, so that v..what...has evaporated completely?"
"This corpse, has no vigor left at all, nor signs for that it used to have any vigor, it vanished completely...."
...even Magil feels curious and confused.
"The one who fought Lynx, might be a Vampire..."
My knowledge about mystery is really limited now.
The ghost girl, the robotic mermaid(siren), and this strange corpse of Lynx, ehh...
Now I eager to leave here too like Kid.
But, it seems Magil doesn't notice our response at all, he still has strong interests with that corpse...
"If it was a Vampire, yes, the vigor will be completely drained, but the soul will not leave the body. And in order to replenish the lost vigor, he will go finding new victims evey night... "
"How boring, you want to say, this corpse has neither soul nor vigor, don't you? But, what's the matter? I don't understand, what do you want to do?"
Kid stares at Magil, impatiently.
My thought is similar to Kid's. There are too many strange things happening here, in the room, oh, the whole manor.
There's no sign of living creatures here, but I can still sense strong mind in this house.
This is, a haunted house...maybe...
"We already have the Frozen Flame, and that bastard Lynx is dead. We have no reason to stay here anymore, let's go."
Kid urges him.
"....don't leave..."
Hearing that, Kid stares at Magil with a clouded face, but then she looks at the gaint mirror on the wall instead.
"...Kid....
You...
have come....you have finally come here...."
......!
...that girl...
shrouded in a worn-out old-style monastery robe...
she looks really sad...
"It seems, she doesn't want us to leave..."





Those lines are their talk right before they meet the Devil Circle(Blood Circle, in original JPN version).
Serge asks Kid why she wants the Frozen Flame, and Kid replies with her past.
What is 'the temple'? Maybe the author means that orphanage, well, if Kid is talking about Lucca, it must be that...

Demiforce version.
Quote
.................

I don't know what she meant by that, but after what happened at the temple, I vowed to get my revenge, and honor what she wanted."
 I stay silent, not knowing what kind of reply to offer.
"I shoulda talked more about it before, before I got you involved in everything, I guess," she says after a while.
"It's bad, Serge..."
 ......

Original
Quote
..................

 でも……
 姉ちゃんがさらわれ、二度と帰って来
ないと知った時、オレは誓ったんだ。
 ヤマネコの野郎からあの石を盗みだし、
姉ちゃんのかたきを討つって」
 キッドの右眼が、闇の中で冷たく燃え
上がった。
「ヤツに、自分のしでかしたことの償い
を、させてやる!!
 オレの命にかえても……。
 どんな代償をはらっても……!」
 キッドはそれだけ言うと、口を閉ざして、
黙りこんでしまう……。
「ゴメン……、キッド。
 ヘンなこと、聞いちゃって……」
 しばらくして、キッドは応えた。
「いや……、いいんだ。
 ほんとは、もっと前に話しておくべきだっ
た。おまえを巻き込んでしまう前に」
「悪かったな、セルジュ……」
 …………。
 ボクには、なんと応えればいいのか、
わからなかった……。
 足音ばかりが、暗い通路をわたって
行く……。

My translation.
Quote
but.....
when Sis was abducted and never returned again, I swore .....
Take the Frozen Flame from that bastard Lynx, and avenge Sis."
Cold light sparkles in Kid's right eye.
"That bastard, he must pay for all he has done!!
Even if trade with my own life....
I will make him pay...!"
Kid says, suddenly, she become quiet。。。
"I'm sorry, Kid....
I understand now..."
After a little while, Kid replies:
"Nothing...I'm OK.
Those things, I should tell you earlier, before you were involved in."
"It's really bad, Serge...."
......
I don't know how to reply...
Only footsteps are left in the dark passage, again....


BTW, In original script, Kid's right eye is metioned many times. Yes, she was like that when she was a child.
Quote
Time passes. After the fire has burnt the building to the ground, the mirror shifts focus to a small girl covered in soot, crying behind the charred remains of her home. She lets loose a bloodcurdling scream into the open sky, as her right eye narrows like a cat's...

I'll quote the water dragon isle script form CC. Reading it give me a very familiar feeling. :P

Quote
Kid:
   ...Where am I?
   I fainted, eh?

Kid:
   Sorry...
   Did I wake you up?
   I had a bad dream.

Kid:
   Seein' that fairy's eyes
   filled with tears over
   losin' her friends...
   That must've triggered
   memories of me own past.

Kid:
   I was an orphan...
   I was abandoned
   when I was a baby...

Kid:
   There was someone who took
   me in and raised me as if I
   were her own little sister...
   I'm alive here today
   thanks to her.

Kid:
   There were a lot of others
   like me at Sis's place,
   and...
   she was always makin'
   strange stuff...
   We didn't have money,
   but we were all happy.


Kid:
   Up until that Lynx bastard...
   came and shattered our
   happiness to pieces!
   Lynx raided our house,
   burned it down, and
   kidnapped Sis!

   
Kid:
   Sister...
   never came back...

   
Kid:
   Since then, I've wandered
   the world and experienced so
   much pain, just to get by...
   No one was there to help me.
   I was always alone.
   If you ask me, the idea of
   guardian angels watchin'
   over us all the time...
   that's a load of rubbish.
   
Kid:
   In this world, the underhanded
   always gets the last laugh.
   Only the ones who don't think
   anything of hurtin' others
   are the ones who get blood-
   stained fortunes.
   The ones who kill,
   the ones who devour,
   they're the ones who survive.
   That's the only rule
   of this world.
   
Kid:
   The great species of mankind...
   our wonderful world,
   filled with love and happiness...
   HA!
   Don't make me laugh!
   
Kid:
   But if that's how it is,
   that's fine with me.
   As long as I'm alive,
   there ain't no goin' back.
   I'll abide by this world's
   rules, and do what I gotta
   do, despite the rotten hand
   of cards I've been dealt!
   
Kid:
   I'll make sure that bloody
   bastard pays for what he's
   done!!!
   I will get even...!
   No matter what it takes!!!

« Last Edit: December 16, 2008, 12:30:23 am by utunnels »

utunnels

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2008, 03:41:55 pm »
I saw someone's talking about this scene in other topic, so I retranslate it. I'm not sure if there're really some important differences.

"I recall, I used to say, this is a foolish world which is full of sadness...."

I remember I heard such words before, or maybe it was just my imagination? Did Magus real say something like this?


Demiforce script.
Quote
I peer around the corner into the cell. In this dim, damp space, an old man sits in solitude, quietly mumbling to himself.
"Hey, Mister..."
"Everyone.. and it was all because of me. Every last one of the Dragoons... Miss Riddel... even the General...! Forgive me... please..."
 Ignoring us, the old man continues to mutter, staring at the floor as he rocks back and forth.
"Hey, can ya hear me?" Kid says, shaking the bars a little.
"He will not hear a thing. He has constructed a wall around himself," Magil says.
"What do you mean?" I ask Magil.
"A wall, used for shielding one's mind from reality. After being exposed to horrific events, tremendous amounts of pain and guilt has this effect on a person. He has made a safe world inside his own mind, where he retreats into. From there, he refuses to acknowledge anything he does not want to admit."
 I notice that talking about this has given Magil a sort of sad, lost look in his face. Noticing my glance, he quickly turns away from me.
 Strange... Magil somehow reminded me of Kid just then.
 When Magil turns back, his usual blank expression has returned.
"Does this make sense to you, Serge?" Magil asks.
[choice1] *"Yeah, it does..."
[choice2] *"Maybe if you gave me an easier explanation..."


[choice1]
 Magil continues, looking at Kid and me. "We rarely see the walls we're trapped within. However, given time, some can come to understand and possibly even break free of these shortcomings... I......"
 I wait for Magil to finish, but he doesn't end up saying anything. I'd ask, but... oh well.
 The mind... Revealing itself to itself...


[choice2]
"Very well," Magil says, taking me aside. "For example, there was probably a time when Kid was very different than who she is now. She couldn't have been a thief her whole life, correct?"
 Hearing this, I look over to Kid. Somehow she looks different than I've ever seen her...
"Kid convinced herself to be a thief. However, on the inside, she's not as rough as you think."
"I see... so in other words, there's a normal man trapped somewhere inside all that mumbling."
"Aw, come on, enough with all this jibber jabber!"
"But Kid, we were just saying..."
 Thwap!
 I stare at Kid, rubbing the red mark left on my cheek.

Original script.
Quote
 ボクは牢のなかを目をこらして見た。
 座っている人影らしきものが闇の中に
かすかに浮かびあがる。
 声はその人影から聞こえてくる。
「おい……、じいさん?」
 キッドが、なかの人影に声をかける。
「……すまぬ、みんな……。わしのせい
で、栄光のアカシア竜騎士団は……。
 大佐……、リデル姫……
 お許しくだされ……、うう……」
 キッドの問いかけに応えず、意味不明
の言葉を壁に向かってつぶやき続ける
老人……。
「じーさん、聞こえないのか?」
「その爺さんには、なにを言ってもムダだ
ろう。殻に閉じこもってしまっている」
 ギルが、キッドにそう告げた。
「なんなの、その殻って?」
 ボクは、ギルに尋ねた。
「自分の認めたくない現実から、我が身
を守るためにつくる盾みたいなものだ。
 背を向けて逃げ出したくなるような、
あまりに悲惨な事件を見るなり、経験
するなり、したのだろう……。
 心のなかに自分だけの別の世界をつく
り、そこに逃げ込んで、外の世界の一切
を拒絶してしまうのだ……」
 なんだかギルの言葉に、言いようのな
い悲しみみたいなものが感じとられて、
ボクは思わずギルを見上げた。
 ギルの瞳は、なぜかキッドを見ていた
……。
 その横顔だけを、見つめていた……。
 ボクの視線に気づいたのか、ギルは振
り向くと、いつもの表情にもどる。
「そういうことも、あるということだ。
 この愚かで、悲しみに満ちた世界では、
な……」
 その瞳が、いつもより心なしかやさし
い光をおびているような気がする。
「わかるか?」
 ท「うん、何となく……」
 ท「もうちょっと簡単な説明、ない?」



 ボクは、ちょっと曖昧な返事をした。
「今一つ理解できない、といった顔だな。
 まぁ、いずれ分かる。そのうちに」
 ボクとキッドの顔を見て、ギルがそう
言った。
 ………???
 どういう意味なんだろう?



「もっとわかりやすく、説明してよ」
 ボクは、さらなるお願いをした。
「そうだな。盗みに入る前に、よくキッド
がボ~ッとしてる時があるな」
 そう言われ、ボクの脳裏に、両手を組
み、瞳にお星さまが一杯のキッドの姿が
映った。
「まだ、盗んでもないのに、既に自分の
物と思い込んでいる。
 ”心ここにあらず”といった状態だ。
 つまり、この爺さんは、それの暗くて、
重いやつだ」
 なるほど……。
 身近な例えをあげてもらうと、やっぱ
りよく理解できる!
「ギィィルゥ……
 その例えは、肖像権の侵害だぞ……」
 なんだ、そりゃ……?
 キッドのこぶしが、いきなりボクに襲い
かかった。
「セルジュ!
 おまえも納得すんな!!」
 思いっきり、とばっちりだ……。


My retranslation.
Quote
I look into the dark prison cell.
In the darkness, I can barely see a man sitting there.
That's where the voices come from.
"Hey...grandpa?"
Kid tries to talk to him.
"....All over, everyone....all because of me, the honored Acacia Dragoons....the general...Miss Riddel...please forgive me...[he sobs]..."
The old man shows no response to Kid, is still muttering something strange to the wall...
"Grandpa, didn't you hear me?"
"It's no use to talk to that old man. He's now in a shell which prevents him to contact with the outer world."
Magil tells Kid.
"What, a shell?"
I don't understand him, so I asks.
"He refused to accept the reality, it is like there's a wall between him and the real world. He's trying his best to avoid anything realistic,  perhaps, he used to have some miserable experience, so...He's now in another world that he built in his heart. He escaped there from the real world and refused anything outside..."
It gives me a feeling, a person without such miserable experience can't speak like what Magil does. So I raise my head and stare at him.
For some reason, Magil is staring at Kid...
I can only see the side of his face...
Discovering I'm looking at him, Magil turns his head back, and his expression becomes normal.
"I recall, I used to say, this is a foolish world which is full of sadness...."
His eyes, maybe that's just my imagination, is gentler than before.
"Understand?"
[choice1]กค"Hmm, sort of..."
[choice2]กค"Can you explain it in a more understandable way?"

[choice1]
I answer uncertainly.
"It is like one's face, you can't read from it immediately. But as time goes by, you will eventually understand."
Magil says, looking at me and Kid.
......???
What does that mean?

[choice2]
"Can you explain in a more understandable way?"
I request.
"For example. Kid, before she was a thief, used to live a completely different life."
Hearing that, I depict Kid who crosses her hands, full of stars in her eyes, in my mind.
"Now, she won't realized she's stealing, instead, she feels like she's taking and using her own properties. This is so called 'preoccupied'.
Anyway, this old man must have some very dark and heavy things in his heart."
Yes it is...
Use a simple example, and it is more understandable!
"Maaaaaaaagil....
Your example has infringed upon my individual right to portrait..."
What is she talking about...?
Kid's fist flies at me.
"Serge!
Now you understand!!"
I was only thinking, how could she react like this...
« Last Edit: December 16, 2008, 01:55:43 am by utunnels »

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2008, 04:04:41 pm »
That makes the foreshadowing about her life as Schala much more certain.

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2008, 04:14:40 pm »
I have a feeling that Magil is talking about his own past while explain the 'shell'.

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #27 on: December 16, 2008, 01:35:07 am »
Kid and Magil really feel like siblings to me, even more so than Janus and Schala did. I like it.

Quote
Your example has infringed my individual right to portrait..."
...Wow, that's broken English. Thinking it means something more like "You're messing with my image...", right?

And even though these retranslated bits are really insightful, I'm still amazed by the Demiforce version. The things they changed just strengthened the message for us, I think.

utunnels

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #28 on: December 16, 2008, 01:49:20 am »
Quote
...Wow, that's broken English. Thinking it means something more like "You're messing with my image...", right?

Well, '肖像権の侵害' means infringe upon one's portrait right literally.
It's a joke, of course, but I don't know whether you can get it.

Quote
Kid and Magil really feel like siblings to me, even more so than Janus and Schala did. I like it.
In certain spots of the game, Kid throws a fist to Magil instead of Serge, but in Demiforce version, she just tries to hit Serge.

Quote
And even though these retranslated bits are really insightful, I'm still amazed by the Demiforce version. The things they changed just strengthened the message for us, I think.
Yeah, I only want to translate it sentence by sentence, it's far from polished translation of course...
« Last Edit: December 16, 2008, 02:13:48 am by utunnels »

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Re: Radical Dreamers Version Differences (spoilers)
« Reply #29 on: December 16, 2008, 04:04:31 am »
-_-b

Quote
"We can't help this old geezer. Let's get back to work," Kid says, already heading for the door.
"Wait, Kid," Magil calls out.
"Somehow or another, we may yet find a way into this man's mind."
"What good'll that do?"
"Didn't you hear what he was talking about? The Dragoons, Riddel, General Viper..."

"Aw, he's prolly just into old folklore or somethin'..." Kid says, returning to the door.
"I have a feeling his knowledge will prove to be useful. Certainly he has heard something of importance concerning our situation," Magil says.
"Well, I guess we oughta help the old bloke out with his troubles while we're here. What do ya say we do?" Kid asks.
[choice 1] *"Somehow, we have to put an end to this..."
[choice 2] *Say nothing, confused.


[choice 1]
"Huh!?" Kid says, looking up. "You got a problem with me!?"
"Eh!? N, no... that's not what I meant..."
 But before I can explain, Kid's fist suddenly flies into my face!
 Narrowly avoiding the blow, I look up to see Magil starting to speak again.


[choice 2]
 Thinking through everything that's been said already, I really have no idea about how to get anywhere with him.
"Well somebody better think of somethin' soon!" Kid says.


My retranslation.
Quote
"It's no use trying to talk to this old man. Better leave him alone, let's go."
Kid says, heading for the entrance.
"Wait, Kid."
Magil calls out.
"Maybe we can still get some informations from this old man."
"What? From this mad oldman, how can we?"
"He was talking about some familiar names...
Acacia Dragoons...
Miss Riddel..."
"Who knows, mabye some moldy old stories."
Kid replies with a sigh.
"Furthermore, under a status like this, how can we believe what he says?"
That's right, how can we ask him if he's in such a mental state...
Magil thinks for a while, then he answers,
"It's simple...
We can bring him back to the reality."
"How? Could it be said that I have to charm this grandpa?"
[choice 1]*"You'd better not..."
[choice 2]*"......"
 I keep silent.

[choice 1]
"You'd better not."
Hearing Kid's words, I answer casually.
"What!?"
Kid stares at me angrily.
"You mean, I don't have such allure, do you, Serge?"
"Ahh!? NO, NO...That's not what I meant..."
"Or, you mean we shall give it up?"
"Indeed, it won't work."
Hearing that, Kid throws a fist to Magil suddenly!
Magil avoids it easily, and continues.

[choice 2]
Hearing Kid's words, I'm about to say something, but suddenly I realize a close mouth catches no flies, so I cover my mouth with my hand immediately.
"What's the matter?"
Kid is surprised by my reaction.
Ho...that was close.
"Indeed, it won't work."
Magil says calmly.
Suddenly, Kid throws a fist to Magil!
Magil avoids it easily, and continues.



What happened t Shea's orphanage. In fact, it was not burnt, but the orphans were all killed.

Quote
"And..."
I recalls that girl with a monastery robe, that robe is unique...But Magil is keeping on talking, it seems he doesn't notice my question at all.
When I'm thinking I might be ignored...
"That's the uniform of the ancient Communion of the Four Spirits ."
But, hearing Magil talking about it, Kid scowls immediately.
"Kid used to live there..."
I remembered, Magil talked about that before. Kid was an orphan adopted by a Sister from the Communion of the Four Spirits. It is said, she was also an orphan, so she got along well with Kid.
But one day, she was taken away by Lynx's minion and never returned. Kid was still very young at that time.
Kid sneaked out of the communion. She wanted to find her in Lynx's house. But little Kid did not managed to reach Lynx's house. When she came back to the village, she found the orphans were all dead.
Magil, a regular vistor of the communion, came to the orphanage one day. He found Kid sitting among the mummyfied corpses, biting her lip while staring at the direction of Lynx's house.
Kid had not spoken for a whole year...it is said, since then, Magil never saw her cry...
« Last Edit: December 16, 2008, 09:06:44 am by utunnels »