Where did the Mystics come from?

[ZealKnight]

Actually the Sun Stone gets me thinking, if it's natural, could they have gotten magic from it? Maybe it in fact is how Mystics received magic in the Lost Sanctum.

[mav]

Well, its power can definitely be utilized, as you can see with the Swallow, the Black Mail, etc, and it was "the foremost source of the elemental energy and magic harnessed by the citizens and sorcerers of Zeal," according to the encyclopedia. So I wouldn't be surprised if the Mystics somehow harnessed its power as well.

[Thought]

Well, ZealKnight, a question for you:

What evolutionary influence did Lavos or the Frozen Flame have on humans?

From CC, it is clearly stated that there was some influence, but we can see that other than being able to use magic, Ayla is essentially the same as Lucca. Because of this, the ability to use Magic is generally seen to be that influence. Now, we'd have a bit of an evolutionary conundrum: two very similar genetic traits evolved in two completely separate species due to completely different circumstances. While not impossible, it is improbable.

As for the Lost Sanctum, I must confess I haven't played CTDS yet. I am currently working on correctly that gap in my knowledge and hopefully will be better able to comment soon.

[ZealKnight]

Well intelligence for one, but Thought wasn't Ayla found at Mystic Mt.?

[ryu planeswalker]

That was Kino, and if Kino was from a future past when the flame had contact with humans we have a huge problem in that basically everything assumed about the flame is bunk because Kino affected the Gene pool a very long time before the flame did.

[Thought]

Doesn't work, ZealKnight. As mentioned, other than speach problems, Ayla appears to be just as intelligent as other humans. Since her people are complex tool users, we might suppose a Neanderthal-like level of sophistication. Which is to say, essentially modern in intellect.

[ZealKnight]

Since her people are complex tool users, we might suppose a Neanderthal-like level of sophistication.

What tools? I wouldn't use the weapons you get from the chief, because those seem more like gaming devices. Also I need to object to this discussion because I see no relevance in it taking place. If you have a point to make, make it. Do not give me the fluff.

[V_Translanka]

It's not usually kosher in the analysis forums to dismiss game evidence as just a game device or whatever. If we're told in-game something is true, it is unless later proven otherwise by further game evidence...

If nothing else, they create quite a few Dreamstone items, which could effect things...for one, it's possible that it's the Dreamstone that gives Ayla her innate fire resistance...

[ZealKnight]

Well I was referring to the completely obvious gaming devices of how their tools were ridiculously more powerful to the present day or future weapons.

[Zephira]

Why would a dreamstone-crafted sword be any less powerful than that of the present day?
Only Lucca and Robo use weapons that would in any way be reliant on technology. For every one else, blunt/sharp objects do pretty much the same amount of damage, no matter what time it's from. If better quality materials or craftsmanship were used in making the weapons, then they'll be that much better.
Just because it looks like a plot device, doesn't mean the Iokans were any less skilled at crafting weapons.

Now, a question. If the Frozen Flame never came into contact with humans, would it have been possible for them to evolve normally? It seems like the Flame only made the humans evolve (and possibly develop magic) faster. It could be that, without Lavos, humans could have evolved, but over a much longer period of time. They could have also discovered whatever natural magics the Mystics and monsters of the Lost Sanctum use.

[ryu planeswalker]

Actually the fact that they are creating sharp edged swords at all is a Major deal, in our time line the concept of Forging weapons out of copper was about 5000 BC?

[V_Translanka]

Our World=/=Chrono World

There are things obviously based on things and events from our world, but the development of technology is one of the more apparent things that does not follow our own technological timeline.

[ryu planeswalker]

Yes, but Ayla's Tribe were in the beginnings of the bronze age they had to have been alot more evolved than the 65 Million BC humans of our timeline, which means that The Flame really couldn't have done alot intellect wise for humanity.

[utunnels]

   A brain that has developed abnormally
   to 3 times the original size in the
   span of 3 million years...

   We humans have evolved at an
   enormous rate because of our
   contact with Lavos's flame...

Man, does that means Ayla's brain is only 1/3 in size of a normal human?
Or perhaps even smaller...

[FouCapitan]

   A brain that has developed abnormally
   to 3 times the original size in the
   span of 3 million years...

   We humans have evolved at an
   enormous rate because of our
   contact with Lavos's flame...

Man, does that means Ayla's brain is only 1/3 in size of a normal human?
Or perhaps even smaller...

That whole statement in Chrono Trigger really bothered me.  There really is no evidence presented that Lavos caused mankind to evolve.

Lavos contacts humans, they evolve.  Lavos caused humans to evolve.

Let's look at a similarly structured statement.

I clap my hands, my back itches.  Clapping my hands causes my back to itch.

Do the people of Chronopolis have any studied examples of human evolution without Lavos being present?  Not in the game, so how can they conclude that human evolution was abnormal?