A few questions about Magus.

[Rufus]

Okay, I have a few questions (and questionable theories to answer my own questions...  yeah) about the one and only Magus.  Here goes.

1.) Why did Janus change his name when he entered the Middle Ages and rose to power within the Mystics?

My theory: Janus thought someone else from 12,000 B.C. would've been shot back into 600 A.D., with him, so he chose to hide his identity in case they would come looking for him.  To hide his past, I suppose.

2.) Why "Magus"?

My theories:

 - Okay, keep an open mind here, this one's totally retarded.  When Janus is older, sitting around with Flea, Slash, and Ozzie, he tells them he wants a new name.  Ozzie suggests Najus, being some kind of inversion of Janus.  Slash disagrees, telling him they should change the letters and sounds up a bit.  Thus Magus comes out.

 - I'm not sure if this one would work.  Frog called Magus by name when he revealed himself from his Prophet get-up.  After seeing Magus's hate for Lavos, Janus decided to name himself after the dark mage.

 - King Zeal's first name was Magus (another shot in the dark).

3.) This might be explained in the Chrono Trigger summary plot, in one of the timelines, but did young Janus endure the same thing as Magus back in the day after Chrono's meddling?  Did Magus, when he was Janus, see all that the new Janus saw?  And if so, wouldn't that make an endless cycle of Magus's and Janus's being each other?  And wouldn't Ozzie get tired of taking in every Janus that appeared in the 600 A.D. forest?

My theory: None.

Ideas?  Thoughts?

[Sentenal]

1.)  He probably wanted to distance himself from everything in his past, including his Mother, a pwn of his hated foe.

2.) Magus means wizard.

3.) No, the Time Bastard theory states that any new version of a time traveler is thrown into the Darkness Beyond Time.  The Magus you get was not the Janus who predicted Crono's death.

[Zaperking]

^Yup Yup Yup

[SilentMartyr]

1.)  He probably wanted to distance himself from everything in his past, including his Mother, a pwn of his hated foe.

2.) Magus means wizard.

3.) No, the Time Bastard theory states that any new version of a time traveler is thrown into the Darkness Beyond Time.  The Magus you get was not the Janus who predicted Crono's death.

1. He needed a way to make it so no Mystic besides Ozzie knew that was really a human. Changing his name from Janus to Magus makes it so no one questions that.

2. Magus means sorcerer, but wizard is close enough

3. Werd

[Daniel Krispin]

Why he changed his name? And why Magus?
He probably didn't. In some later renderings, as has been said, Magus has been taken to be 'wizard' or 'sorcerer', though in the original Latin it means something more akin to 'wise man', and is pronounced MAH-gus (the plural being Magi) Technically, the word is not even Latin - it comes from Persia, where it was a name for their priestly class. Thus the 'wise man' connection.
Anyway, if my own theories hold in some regard, the history of the world was more or less similar to ours up until about 400AD - thus Rome existed (I take this from the existance of crosses on the doors to the church, the existance of cathedrals, and in the existance of Latin itself in several key points, ie. Angelus Errare and Res Nullem) The Mystics, being more from the East, and having at least some of that older knowledge, would probably know Latin, or at least their leadership ranks might. Seeing the power and keen mind of the child, especially later when he is grown to power, they give him the throne-name of 'Magus', ie. the Sorcerer. It shrouds him in mystery, and cements his leadership position all the more. To have a foe simply named 'The Sorcerer' is a lot more frightening than one with a name proper. Like Sauron being named 'The Necromancer'. It's a lot more chilling.
As a matter of fact, though, the name Janus (pronounced ee-AH-nuss) is interesting in and of itself, as it is the name of one of the old Roman gods who, to my knowledge, is not one of those borrowed from other people (unlike Juno, Jove/Jupiter, Mars, Minerva, etc.) From what I know, he was a god of beginnings and endings, and of doorways, signalling change. He was worshipped to, for example, at sowing and harvest, and the doors to the temple of Janus were cast upon at the onset of war, to signify a course set upon irrevocably.

[GrayLensman]

3.) This might be explained in the Chrono Trigger summary plot, in one of the timelines, but did young Janus endure the same thing as Magus back in the day after Chrono's meddling?  Did Magus, when he was Janus, see all that the new Janus saw?  And if so, wouldn't that make an endless cycle of Magus's and Janus's being each other?  And wouldn't Ozzie get tired of taking in every Janus that appeared in the 600 A.D. forest?

3.) No, the Time Bastard theory states that any new version of a time traveller is thrown into the Darkness Beyond Time.  The Magus you get was not the Janus who predicted Crono's death.

When Magus was sent back to 12,000 BC, a new timeline was created from that point onward, and the original timeline was sent to the Darkness Beyond Time (DBT), which acts like a cosmic trash bin.  Magus's past world line (his own personal timeline) exists in the original timeline only, so his past is not affected by changes to the new timeline.

Magus's flashback of the Ocean Palace disaster follows the events of the original timeline, before the time travellers intervened.  The original version of Janus did not encounter Crono in Zeal.

In the new timeline, there is a new version of Janus, who the time travellers encounter.  This version of Janus is not warped to the middle ages to become Magus.  The original version of Janus (Magus's true precursor) who arrives in the middle ages has immunity as well so the new version of Janus is sent to the DBT instead.

The mechanics of time travel effectively prevents time loops or other paradoxes from occurring.

[Rufus]

The original version of Janus (Magus's true precursor) who arrives in the middle ages has immunity as well so the new version of Janus is sent to the DBT instead.

What exactly is the Darkness Beyond Time?  Do travelers float in a black void or just die?

And to everyone else: Thanks, guys.

[Sentenal]

Darkness beyond time, terreseract, etc etc.   It was a plot element in CC, and basically where all erased timelines go to not exist.  The DBT was the place where Lavos and Schala ended up, and it was the place where you fought the Time Devourer.  Basically just time's trash can.  I don't know that a person there nessisarily dies, but its safe enough to say that.

[Radical_Dreamer]

I've always viewed Magus more as a title than a name. Janus is who he is, Magus is what he is. In the Japanese, his name was Maou, which means wizard king. Pretty apt name, for a wizard who is a king. Although, he probably intentionally blured the line between name and title, so as to seperate himself from Janus, which is who he was.

I lived there once, but I was a different person then.

Magus clearly sees a distinction between the prince of Zeal and the king of the Mystics. Doesn't surprise me, it's an entirely different life.

[Sentenal]

He was probably given the Title Magus by the Mystics, and then adopted it to entirely as his name.

[Daniel Krispin]

I've always viewed Magus more as a title than a name. Janus is who he is, Magus is what he is. In the Japanese, his name was Maou, which means wizard king. Pretty apt name, for a wizard who is a king. Although, he probably intentionally blured the line between name and title, so as to seperate himself from Janus, which is who he was.

Exactly! Magus has always been a title. In the Bible you have Simon Magus, for example, and the Magi are just that, the Magi. Those aren't their names (those are Melchior, Balthezar, and Gaspar... all Persian names, probably); that is their plural title. So, in all technicality, it would probably be Janus Magus, but you know how these dark lords are... they have quite the domineering streak, and if he acts anything like Sauron does, he would not allow his servants to speak his name. Thus, it may just be that they began calling him by his title Lord Magus, and the name remained. That, and the old stories put some power into the knowing of something's true name - such as Sigurd not telling his to Fafnir, after he has killed that infamous dragon, or Isis learning the true name of Ra and thus surplanting his power. Perhaps he feels that any that know it will gain some measure of power over him, and so refrains from its use for that reason.

[Radical_Dreamer]

I've always viewed Magus more as a title than a name. Janus is who he is, Magus is what he is. In the Japanese, his name was Maou, which means wizard king. Pretty apt name, for a wizard who is a king. Although, he probably intentionally blured the line between name and title, so as to seperate himself from Janus, which is who he was.

Exactly! Magus has always been a title. In the Bible you have Simon Magus, for example, and the Magi are just that, the Magi. Those aren't their names (those are Melchior, Balthezar, and Gaspar... all Persian names, probably); that is their plural title. So, in all technicality, it would probably be Janus Magus, but you know how these dark lords are... they have quite the domineering streak, and if he acts anything like Sauron does, he would not allow his servants to speak his name. Thus, it may just be that they began calling him by his title Lord Magus, and the name remained. That, and the old stories put some power into the knowing of something's true name - such as Sigurd not telling his to Fafnir, after he has killed that infamous dragon, or Isis learning the true name of Ra and thus surplanting his power. Perhaps he feels that any that know it will gain some measure of power over him, and so refrains from its use for that reason.

I was unaware that with Simon Magus, Magus was a title. I read that as being a name. I would think that Magus (CT) was more along the lines of Magus Janus Zeal (title, first name, last name). I recal other traditions holding that names of divine beings could be used to gain power over them. A friend of mine, who became Orthodox Jewish, maintained that Jesus was in fact able to walk on water, but simply because he had the true name of God carved in his sandals. I say simply, although the true name of the Judeo-Christian god has been lost for millenia.

[Daniel Krispin]

I was unaware that with Simon Magus, Magus was a title. I read that as being a name. I would think that Magus (CT) was more along the lines of Magus Janus Zeal (title, first name, last name). I recal other traditions holding that names of divine beings could be used to gain power over them. A friend of mine, who became Orthodox Jewish, maintained that Jesus was in fact able to walk on water, but simply because he had the true name of God carved in his sandals. I say simply, although the true name of the Judeo-Christian god has been lost for millenia.

Magus in Simon Magus was most certainly a title. Although I never really thought of 'Zeal' as being a last name. I always thought it as more of a title, also, a throne-name so to speak that the sovereigns of Zeal took when they ascended the throne, essentially then embodying the land in corporeal form - another way of saying 'lord of Zeal.' Thus Schala, after the fall of Zeal and the death of the last queen, becomes 'Schala Zeal', Schala of Zeal, or Schala Queen of Zeal.
As far as the name of God being lost... not really. There never really was a name, so to speak, and names in those days were... variable. Marduk of the Babylonians had fifty names, ranging from Marduk itself to Bel, that is, Lord. For that matter, the Judeo-Christian God was thus often called Bel, or Baal, as it was spelled by the Caananites (in the region where the Hebrews were), simply denoting 'Lord'. The Hebrews also borrowed the name of the Caananite chief divinity, the bull god El, for their own. Thus my own name, Daniel, which means 'God has vindicated me/God is my judge' - I assume you can spot 'el' at the end. Anyway, as for the true name, or the most holy name... well, is anyone Jewish hereabouts? Because Jews dislike it when anyone speaks or spells it, it is so holy to them (Legend of the Past over at Chronicles got annoyed at me once for it, so I stopped doing it.) Christians don't have a problem with it, but I think it essentially comes from the verb 'to be', basically denoting something/someone that always was and shall be. In the old way it was spelled YHWH (ie. Yahweh... and if there are any Jews on this site that want me to remove this, I'll remove this out of respect), which leads to great difficulties. Mazoritic scholars, attempting to be paralitic, took a name of God that appears side by side to it, Adonai, and put those vowels into YHWH, yielding YAHOWAH, which comes down to us as the totally misspelled Jehovah - apparently it really threw scholars for a loop who couldn't figure out what sort of name that was. Eventually they figured out it wasn't one at all, but just a quirk that the Mazoritic translators put in when they were putting vowels into the previously non-vowel spelling. But to Christians I would say that the true name of our God is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, but that's another matter, I suppose.

[Sentenal]

just to the clarify the LOTR analogy with Sauron being called the Necromancer...  At the time when they called him the Necromancer, they did not know it was Sauron.  They assumed it was simply a Nazgul or something.

[V_Translanka]

I'm pretty much with Radical_Dreamer on this one...All of that Janus to Magus stuff can be blamed on Ted Woosley...nyuk nyuk...

Although, Radical_Dreamer, I thought that maou meant demon king not wizard king...I had never heard wizard before...