Split Dimensions and Traveling Into the Future

[Shadow_Dragon]

Sentenal, you're missing my point by taking a frame of reference that I think the game only takes at the beginning to make Serge feel out of place. You're ignoring the fact that everything that happens in Another World prior to 1010AD also happens in Home World, although neither can really be called that until they split. How can you judge that Serge was supposed to die? Maybe Schala was supposed to save him, and the abnormality was when he died? It doesn't make a difference, because neither world is more 'real' than the other.

To be sure that Another World isn't the abnormality, there would have to have been a 100% chance of Serge's drowning, as there is with every event (that's why there aren't splintering dimensions at every instance), and then, through Schala's saving him (which excludes the 100% chance, because it's special temporally... for example, there's a 100% chance that I'll be typing this post, but maybe in the future I'll go back and stop myself from typing it) Home World was created.
If that were the case, the dual-dimension diagram would look like this:
.......................--------------------------
...................../
--------------------------------------------
Ignore the periods since I don't know how to do it without them

However, this isn't the case. The game explicitely states that there was a 50% chance for Serge's death and Serge's survival, so both dimensions are equally as 'normal' and as 'abnormal'. The whole 'Home World is the abnormality' is merely a point of view, and an exagerated fact that it's the effect of temporal alterations, as compared to Another World, which would be NEAR to the timeline had Schala not involved (because, without Schala's intereference Serge would've died, so Serge's dying with Schala's influence would be SIMILAR to Serge's dying without Schala, but not exactly)

So, the diagram should look like this:
......................------------------------
.................../
---------------
...................\
.....................-------------------------

So, how can we decide which dimension someone from before the split time-travels into without deciding that s/he will go into both?


EDIT: I made a contradiction by describing the 50%-life-death diagram with what would happen in the 100%-death when I wasn't paying attention

[DarkGizmo]

that look like the diagram I did on some other post

if Crono-kid-ghost say that Home world is an abnormaly or something like this the diagrame should look like this
............................Home World
.......................--------------------------
...................../
--------------------------------------------
..................Another World

[Shadow_Dragon]

Yeah, I think I got the idea for those diagrams from whatever post you made that one in before... However, I was trying to proove that both are abnormalities

[Sentenal]

No, your going directly against what the game says.  Serge was supposed to have drowned.  Home is an irregularity.  Another is more 'real' than home.  This is explicit.

[DarkGizmo]

Who? certainly not me with my diagram?

[Shadow_Dragon]

No, your going directly against what the game says.  Serge was supposed to have drowned.  Home is an irregularity.  Another is more 'real' than home.  This is explicit.

The game also 'explicitely' states that there was a 50% chance for Serge's death and a 50% chance for Serge's survival; which is more factual than opinion, 50/50% or 'supposed to have drowned'?

I turned on my TV. It was 'supposed to' have turned on, but there was a blackout the second I turned on my TV. Does that mean that there's a dimension where there was no blackout, and that the world I now live in as an abnormality?

'Supposed to' is just a point of view

And, yes, Serge SHOULD have drowned, but Schala interfered and made it possible for Serge to both be drowned and saved. This does NOT mean that the world in which Serge drowned is what would've happened had Schala not interfered, and what would've happened is what the game refers to as 'supposed to have happened'

[Sentenal]

If you want to go directly agianst the game, feel free.  I've already proved my point.

[Shadow_Dragon]

And I've prooved why you're misinterpreting what the game says, but you're merely saying that the game states something instead of countering my interpretation or showing evidence that directly contradicts me...
So, I recall hearing the game say that Serge was supposed to die, and that Home World was an abnormality, but does it ever say that Another World isn't also an abnormality?

[Sentenal]

The line you refer to as '50-50' means simply that serge dies in one world, and he didn't in another.  50-50.

Here, look at it like this:

Crono does his thing, El Nido eventually is created.  We get to 1010.  Serge dies.  DIES.  Time moves forward, we get to 10XX, Kid goes back in time, saves Serge from drowning, and for some reason or another, this causes the dimensional split.

Serge was SUPPOSED to drown.  Home is an irregularity.

And your question about the game saying Another isn't also an irregularity:  When it said Home was an irregularity, it was realative to Another being the real, true one.  So basically: its heavly implied.

[Shadow_Dragon]

Prophet:
   Serge... This world is not
   the world you grew up in.
   10 years ago, something
   happened that put your very
   soul teetering on the
   balancing scales of fate...
   with a fifty-fifty chance
   of life or death!
   This is when your future
   was split in twain.


I think that definitely makes it seem like there was a chance of life and death, not just that life happened in one world and death in another



 [Crono]
   Where even angels lose
   their way...
   Ten years ago, you died
   at this very spot.
   There's no mistake.
   You drowned.
   The truth is, this world,
   in which you are still
   alive, is the irregularity...
   This is the false reality!

This does make it seem like Home World itself is the irregularity, but it really emphasizes that a word in which he lived is the irregularity, which, as I stated before, is true because there'd be no chance for Serge's survival had Kid (I'll use Kid instead of Schala now because, after rereading some of the script, I found out that Kid, in the future, went back in time to save Serge.. but I don't know if that means that the Kid in the game is actually older than she should be from existing in the future) not intervened. However, a world in which Serge died could be the false reality or 'reality'.


[Lucca]
   ...
   Further in the future, Kid
   is meant to travel back ten
   years in time from now to
   save Serge from drowning.

Yes, this all seems nice and contradictory to me in that it makes sure that Kid saved Serge for sure. But this leaves a hole; if this means to say that Kid DID save Serge, and that Another World is where Kid didn't save him, why didn't she? The splitting point between Another and Home Worlds is supposed to be when Serge either died or lived, so Kid should've acted exactly similar in both worlds up until the point where Serge either died or lived. So Kid had to have come back in both dimensions, so BOTH would be different than the ideal timeline since Kid's presence would affect things (maybe Lynx/Wazuki would've acted differently in the future because he saw Kid, or maybe her presence in the water to save Serge caused a ripple that caused a fish to swim in the opposite direction which caused a fisherman to get one more fire one day etc.).


Once again, Crono does not call Another World the reality, just that Home World is the false reality, and the 'the' instead of an 'a' is because he's showing that Serge shouldn't have lived...


Now that I think about it, this is what the diagram should look like:
...................---------------------
................./
------------------------------------
.................\
...................---------------------
The center one is what was supposed to happen, but Kid went back in time to create 2 whole new ones...



Sentenal: I guess I didn't answer your post's statements specifically, so I'll do that now:
As I kind of said before, it doesn't call Home the abnormality in reference specifically to Another World, but it calls the one in which Serge lived the abnormality, which is positive, in reference to the one in which Serge died, which might be an abnormality (the one where Kid travels back in time isn't the abnormality, and the one in which Kid appears to try to save Serge is)

Also, I'm interested to know whether Belthasar is ever in Home World

[Sentenal]

Do you realize your entire arguement is based on Crono Ghost not saying Another is the real one?

We have 2 dimensions:  One is confirmed to be irregular.  By process of elimination, the other one is the real one.

[DarkGizmo]

I agree on sentenal, because in the original timeline is exactly what happened in another world's.

But I see your point, if Kid would have got throught time in both dimension and that's when the split happens eahc dimension would be differrent, there would be

Original Timeline : Wakuzi drowned Serge
Home world : Kid goes back in time and save Serge
Another World : Kid goes back in time but don't save Serge

When I rather thinks Kid going into the past made the split

Original Timeline : Wakuzi drowned Serge
Home world : Kid goes back in time and save Serge
Another World : Kid don't goes back in time and Waakuzi drowned Serge

In the last version Another and the Key-stone 1 (I think that the timeline?) are the same. While in the other they are different

[Shadow_Dragon]

Ok, if the split really didn't happen until Serge died or lived, then everything I said remains.
However, if the split occured when Kid traveled back in time, with one Kid not appearing in one dimension, that makes sense, but then the common perception of Serge causing the split should be changed...


Also, if Kid never appeared to save Serge in Another World, does that mean that Kid in the game (from Another World) goes back in time after the events of CC to save Serge? Or does Kid's traveling from Another World after the time of CC affect Another World to make Kid not time-travel.. but then Kid would disappear if Time Bastard works correctly.. Maybe the 'Radical Dreamers' that everyone talks about in Home World Arni are really led by the Kid that saved Serge..

[Sentenal]

Well, to my knowledge, the split is marked by Serge's death/survival.  Regardless, Another=Real (for reasons stated above), and Home=Not (because game says so).

[Legend of the Past]

You asked why Another's Kid didn't save Serge. Maybe it's not like she didn't try. Maybe her plan was foiled by Lynx? Plus I've got this theory:

If a Time Egg is used to revive somone and a clone is not used it causes a powerful effect in Space\Time.

Kid isn't the brightest or most cautious person on earth, so I like to think she didn't bother (Or forgot) to replace Serge with a clone...  

Wait, maybe this confimres the fate of the third Time Egg, which is supposed to be in Melchior's hands?