Author Topic: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide  (Read 8422 times)

FaustWolf

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CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« on: January 12, 2008, 02:17:29 am »
Well, better late than never! My Nu Year's gift to fellow Chrono modders is attached. It's a 20-page, heavily illustrated guide to a fairly efficient methodology for CT background insertion. Of academic interest to fellow hackers is Chrono Trigger Background Graphics Info.xls, a listing of every tile set's composition in terms of graphics packs, as well as the locations of all palettes and palette shifts.

I'm hoping to make good on the guide's Valentine's Day theme with Volume II, a sprite insertion tutorial.



Time to get this party started. Over the next few months or so I plan to slowly compile a step-by-step guide for insertion of foreign environments into Chrono Trigger. This is most definitely possible; if we can insert Julie Dillon's awesome Magus artwork as an ending pic, we can do just about anything as long as we reduce it to the necessary amount of colors and meet compression requirements.

I've got some notes on tile insertion that I'll add piecemeal, but I'm definitely not the most experienced person here on that subject; for one thing, I'm still iffy on how to find a given location's graphics packets once I know the graphics packet index and I invite others (*cough*Vehek*cough* 8)) to dump some knowledge at any point in this thread as we move along. The end product, I'm hoping, will be a spiffy user-friendly guide comparable to the one Zeality created for portrait insertion -- find that here:
http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Changing_the_status_menu_portraits.html

But the first step is to make this interactive and useful to current projects -- what other game's environment would you all like to see in Chrono Trigger? Anything that could be used in Crimson Echoes? The sky's the limit -- if you can find me an image, we can do an insert once some palette reduction is done if necessary. As a random example, I'd recommend something from the very beautiful Seiken Densetsu III:
http://www.spriters-resource.com/squenix/mana/sd3/

Environments can be seen at the bottom of that page from the Spriters' Resource. I've got my eye on the Rabite Forest, but the water transparencies may be difficult to implement; I haven't done that sort of thing in Flux yet, though I think something like this was implemented for the Cerulean Lake in Prophet's Guile if I'm not mistaken. I've got to return to the Cross hacking thread for awhile, but I'll be happy to take suggestions on environments (or even just object tiles) to insert into CT in the meantime.

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« Last Edit: January 01, 2009, 01:03:02 am by FaustWolf »

justin3009

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2008, 04:09:37 pm »
This is possible, I did this with Manoria Cathedral graphics but...I had to take the graphics out due to corruption.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEeI7kRShZ4

FaustWolf

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2008, 04:16:59 pm »
Ah, it is quite different in Manoria Cathedral in your vid; I didn't notice that earlier, since I was focusing on the Lucca-> Schala conversion in your vids the whole time. Where did you get the tileset you used in the Cathedral, or did you make them yourself?

justin3009

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2008, 04:20:46 pm »
I used to be a huge RPG maker fan when I was younger and I was scrolling through Chipsets to use to test, and I found some random one that looked nice.

Edward

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2008, 05:46:59 pm »
A program I came across on romhacking.net lets you view tilesets from emulator savestates, and save them as an image file, among other neat stuff.

http://www.romhacking.net/utils/274/

Perhaps it can be of assistance in importing other games tilesets?
Now that I think about it, tilesets could be ripped right from the tileviewers available (like tilemolester) and put in directly or somesuch.

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FaustWolf

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2008, 06:18:39 pm »
Ah, thanks Edward! I'll have to thank creathceann for this functionality in VSNES. Does it allow easy sprite ripping as well (only a tangentially related topic, but something of extreme interest to me)?

Edward

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2008, 06:25:41 pm »
Yeah, I saved a state from Prophet's Guile for the screenshot shown, and other areas of graphics viewable showed sprites and everything else graphics related (fonts, status affects, window graphics...). Clicking the different palette entries applies that palette entry to the displayed graphics, overall a spiffy program. Works with Snes9x and ZSNES savestates I believe.

Ironically, I used this program to view the tilesets of Secret of Mana and SD3 not too long ago with the same idea of importing them to CT.

FaustWolf

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2008, 06:32:48 pm »
Awesome, Edward! We can combine our efforts on such a project and post our methods here for everyone's perusal if you'd like.

Say, as a Seiken Densetsu III player, do you happen to recall if the character "Eagle" has more sprites than what are shown here?
http://www.spriters-resource.com/squenix/mana/sd3/display.php?file=eagle.png

The spritesheet seemed kinda limited, but I've never played far enough into SD3 as Hawk for that encounter.

Edward

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #8 on: January 12, 2008, 06:53:16 pm »
I have yet to dig into SD3 in the same way I've molested SOM and CT. I am unsure about Eagle's sprites, though it shouldn't be to hard to find out with some hacking. I was on that site earlier today myself, there just aren't enough good sprite rip resources on the net these days, some of my favorite sites are MIA.

Lets decide on a tileset from SD3 to import, post a savestate for all to download, and work on that one tileset as a project, posting notes, screens and tips as we go untill we get it in, fully functioning. Then, we can take the best bits we post and make a tutorial. Savestates are a good place to start, since they contain all the graphics and palette information for the tilesets.

(just noticed you mentioned rabite forest, how about that one? It does look very nice...)
« Last Edit: January 12, 2008, 06:55:16 pm by Edward »

justin3009

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2008, 07:25:09 pm »
Replace 600 AD Canyon with Rabite forest tilesets or Guardia Forest...Either way it would work.

FaustWolf

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2008, 08:06:18 pm »
I'm down with 600AD Canyon to Rabite Forest myself. But we should import to whichever tileset seems most "dense" in Temporal Flux, i.e., the tiles already existing shouldn't have lots of empty space in them. More empty space means the compression (probably Run Length Encoding; Geiger would know exactly what kind is used though) is greater, robbing us of space in the ROM that we could use without having to adjust pointers.

Edward, will you be able to get a savestate with the Rabite Forest tileset?

Edward

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2008, 08:14:18 pm »
It won't be untill later tonight sometime, but yes, I have everything I need to acquire a savestate with that tileset in it. No later than tommorow morning I should have it posted and we begin from there.

justin3009

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2008, 08:33:36 pm »
Savestate here

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FaustWolf

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2008, 08:44:25 pm »
Justin, you have INSANE skillz today! I won't be able to start this for awhile on my part, so no rush yet. Major thanks for getting that!

Edward

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Re: CT Foreign Tileset Insertion: Development of a Guide
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2008, 02:57:17 am »
Thanks for the savestate Justin!

Open the savestate up in Tile Molester, the tileset we want is at offset 00023CB3.
The Codec used to view/edit the graphics is 4bpp planar, composite (2x2bpp).

To apply the correct palette to the graphics, go to the menu... Palette - Import From - Another File.
Browse to and open the same savestate, and cycle through the palettes untill the proper one is applied (I couldn't get the Use This File option to work for me).

It looks like different chunks of the tileset have different palettes, and the tileset looks nice in several of them.


So, I imagine the next step is to locate and decompress the tilesets we want to replace. Tile Molester can have multiple files open at once, and you can copy and paste between them quite easily.

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« Last Edit: January 13, 2008, 03:14:39 am by Edward »